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Old 03-10-2013, 11:40 PM   #11
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References to 2 Peter before Origen according to biblindex

2 Peter 1:8 - Odae Salomonis
Date: ca.1 - ca.200
Genre: Poetry
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 1350
Biblio:
HARRIS R., MINGANA A., The Odes and Psalms of Solomon, 2, The translation, 2e éd., Manchester 1920.
11 § 23 (p.267, l.21) BP1

1:10 - Epistula Apostolorum
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Epistle
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 22
Biblio:
DUENSING H., in HENNECKE E., SCHNEEMELCHER W., Neutestamentliche Apokryphen, 1, Evangelien, 3e éd., Tübingen 1959, 127-155.
§ 26 (p.140, l.38) BP1

1:10 - Clement of Alexandria Stromata
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Faith and Christian Reflection
Clavis: 1377
Biblio:
STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., 3e éd., GCS 52 (1960) pour les livres 1-6 ; STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., TREU U., 2e éd., GCS 17 (1970), 3-102 pour les livres 7-8.
7 66 § 4 (p.48, l.4) BP1

1:11 Heracleon - In Ioannem (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Commentary
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1137
Biblio:
VOELKER W., Quellen zur Geschichte der christlichen Gnosis, Tübingen 1932, 63-85.
(p.71, l.23) BP1

1:13 - 14 - Sentences of Sextus - Sexti Sententiae
Date: ca.101 - ca.250
Genre: Maxim
Theme: Philosophy
Clavis: 1115
Biblio:
CHADWICK H., The Sentences of Sextus (Texts and Studies, N.S., 5), Cambridge 1959.

1:16, 18 - Acta Petri graeca (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Acts
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 190
Biblio:
20 (p.342, l.4) BP1

1:18 Apocalypsis Petri graeca (eth.) (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 317
Biblio:
MAURER Ch., DUENSING H., in HENNECKE E., SCHNEEMELCHER W., Neutestamentliche Apokryphen, 2, Apostolisches, Apokalypsen und Verwandtes, 3e éd., Tübingen 1964, 472-483.

1:19 - Acta Pauli A (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Acts
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 211
Biblio:
SCHMIDT C., Praxeis Paulou, Acta Pauli nach dem Papyrus der Hamburger Staats- und Universitäts-Bibliothek, Glückstadt - Hamburg 1936, 22-60.
(p.58, l.27) BP1

1:20, 21 - Demonstratio de Christo et Antichristo (Peri tou antichristou)* (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Christ
Clavis: 1872
Biblio:
ACHELIS H., GCS 1,2 (1897) , 3-47.
§ 2 (p.5, l.1) BP2

1:21 - Theophilus of Antioch Ad Autolycum III (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Protreptic
Theme: Apologetics
Clavis: 1107
Biblio:
BARDY G., SENDER J., SC 20 (1948).
2 9 (p.120, l.1) BP1

2:1 - Apocalypsis Petri graeca (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 317
Biblio:
KLOSTERMANN E., Apokrypha, 1, Reste des Petrusevangeliums, der Petrusapokalypse und des Kerygma Petri (Kleine Texte 3), Bonn 1903, 8-11.
§ 1 (p.8, l.1) BP1

2:1 Clement of Rome (Ps) Homiliae (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.400
Genre: Narrative
Theme: Biography
Clavis: 1015
Biblio:
REHM B., GCS 42 (1953).
2 17 § 4 (p.42, l.8 - /) BP2

2:2 - Apocalypsis Petri graeca (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 317
Biblio:
KLOSTERMANN E., Apokrypha, 1, Reste des Petrusevangeliums, der Petrusapokalypse und des Kerygma Petri (Kleine Texte 3), Bonn 1903, 8-11.
§ 1 (p.8, l.1) BP1

2:2 Clement of Alexandria Protrepticus (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Undetermined
Theme: Faith
Clavis: 1375
Biblio:
MONDESERT C., PLASSART A., 2e éd., SC 2 (1949).
106 § 2 (p.174, l.10) BP1

2:4 - Tertullian De anima (1)
Date: ca.208 - ca.213
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Undetermined
Clavis: 17
Biblio:
WASZINK J.H., CCL 2 (1954), 781-869.
7 § 3 (p.790, l.12) BP1

2:5 Oracula Sibyllina (1)
Date: ca.1 - ca.300
Genre: Poetry
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 1352
Biblio:
GEFFCKEN J., GCS 8 (1902).
1 (p.19, l.281) BP1

2:5 - Clement of Alexandria Stromata (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Faith and Christian Reflection
Clavis: 1377
Biblio:
STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., 3e éd., GCS 52 (1960) pour les livres 1-6 ; STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., TREU U., 2e éd., GCS 17 (1970), 3-102 pour les livres 7-8.
1 135 § 3 (p.84, l.7) BP1

2:6 - Clement of Alexandria Paedagogus (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Christian life
Clavis: 1376
Biblio:
STAEHLIN O., 2e éd., GCS 12 (1936), 89-292.
3 43 § 5 (p.262, l.5) BP1

2:16 - Acta Petri graeca (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Acts
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 190
Biblio:
12 (p.304, l.13) BP1

2:19 - De recta in Deum fide (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.300
Genre: Dialogue
Theme: Heresy
Clavis: 1726
Biblio:
VAN DE SANDE BAKHUYZEN W.H., GCS 4 (1901).
(p.58, l.2) BP2

2:19 Clement of Rome (Ps) Recognitiones (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.400
Genre: Undetermined
Theme: Undetermined
Clavis: 1015
Biblio:
REHM B., GCS 51 (1965).
5 12 § 4 (p.171, l.16 - /) BP2

2:19 Hippolytus In Danielem (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Commentary
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1873
Biblio:
BARDY G., LEFEVRE M., SC 14 (1947).
3 22 § 4 (p.244, l.6) BP2

2:21 Apocalypsis Petri graeca (2)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 317
Biblio:
KLOSTERMANN E., Apokrypha, 1, Reste des Petrusevangeliums, der Petrusapokalypse und des Kerygma Petri (Kleine Texte 3), Bonn 1903, 8-11.
§ 22 (p.9, l.26) BP1
§ 28 (p.11, l.5) BP1

Apocalypsis Petri graeca (eth.) (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 317
Biblio:
MAURER Ch., DUENSING H., in HENNECKE E., SCHNEEMELCHER W., Neutestamentliche Apokryphen, 2, Apostolisches, Apokalypsen und Verwandtes, 3e éd., Tübingen 1964, 472-483.
§ 7 (p.475, l.25) BP1

2:21 Clement of Rome (Ps) Recognitiones (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.400
Genre: Undetermined
Theme: Undetermined
Clavis: 1015
Biblio:
REHM B., GCS 51 (1965).
2 21 § 7 (p.65, l.10 - /) BP2

2:22 Euangelium ueritatis (bis) (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Gospel
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 1177
Biblio:
MALININE M., PUECH H.-Ch., QUISPEL G., TILL W.C., Evangelium veritatis (Supplementum), Zürich - Stuttgart 1961.
(p.3, l.14) BP1

2:22 Clement of Alexandria Protrepticus (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Undetermined
Theme: Faith
Clavis: 1375
Biblio:
MONDESERT C., PLASSART A., 2e éd., SC 2 (1949).
92 § 4 (p.160, l.21) BP1
Stromata (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Faith and Christian Reflection
Clavis: 1377
Biblio:
STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., 3e éd., GCS 52 (1960) pour les livres 1-6 ; STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., TREU U., 2e éd., GCS 17 (1970), 3-102 pour les livres 7-8.
1 2 § 2 (p.4, l.3) BP1

2:22 Hippolytus In Prouerbia (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Fragment
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1883
Biblio:
RICHARD M., Les fragments du commentaire de S. Hippolyte sur les Proverbes de Salomon, Le Muséon 79 (1966), 75-94.
(p.91, l.3 - >) BP2
Refutatio omnium haeresium (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Heresy
Clavis: 1899
Biblio:
WENDLAND P., GCS 26 (1916).
9 7 § 3 (p.241, l.3) BP2

3:5 Papyrus Berlin 9794 (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.300
Genre: Undetermined
Theme: Undetermined
Clavis: 0
Biblio:
WESSELY Ch., PO 18,3 (1924), 429-433.
(p.431, l.47 - >) BP2

3:6 Clement of Rome (Ps) Homiliae (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.400
Genre: Narrative
Theme: Biography
Clavis: 1015
Biblio:
REHM B., GCS 42 (1953).
9 2 § 1 (p.132, l.13) BP2

3:7 Irenaeus Demonstratio (1)
Date: ca.177 - ca.200
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Catechesis
Clavis: 1307
Biblio:
FROIDEVAUX L.M., SC 62 (1959).
69 (p.137, l.7) BP1

3:7 Clement of Alexandria Paedagogus (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Christian life
Clavis: 1376
Biblio:
STAEHLIN O., 2e éd., GCS 12 (1936), 89-292.
1 29 § 1 (p.107, l.13) BP1

3:7 Acta Thomae 1' (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.300
Genre: Acts
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 245
Biblio:
§ 12 (p.117, l.17 - /) BP2

3:7 Hippolytus Capita contra Gaium (Apologia)* (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Fragment
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1891
Biblio:
in DIONYSIVS BAR SALIBI, In Apocalypsim, SEDLACEK I., CSCO 60 (1910), 1 ; 2 ; 8-14 ; 19-20.
(p.9, l.21 - >) BP2

In Prouerbia (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Fragment
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1883
Biblio:
RICHARD M., Les fragments du commentaire de S. Hippolyte sur les Proverbes de Salomon, Le Muséon 79 (1966), 75-94.
(p.77, l.17) BP2

3:8 Epistula Barnabae (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Epistle
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 1050
Biblio:
FUNK F.X., BIHLMEYER K., Die apostolischen Väter, Neubearbeitung der Funkschen Ausgabe, 2e éd., Tübingen 1956, 10-34.
15 § 4 (p.29, l.6) BP1

3:8 Hippolytus Capita contra Gaium (Apologia)* (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Fragment
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1891
Biblio:
in DIONYSIVS BAR SALIBI, In Apocalypsim, SEDLACEK I., CSCO 60 (1910), 1 ; 2 ; 8-14 ; 19-20.
(p.20, l.16 - < >) BP2

3:9 Hermas Pastor (1)
Date: ca.140 - ca.150
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Penance
Clavis: 1052
Biblio:
JOLY R., SC 53 (1958).
77 § 1 (p.286, l.4) BP1

3:9 Clement of Rome (Ps) Homiliae (2)
Date: ca.201 - ca.400
Genre: Narrative
Theme: Biography
Clavis: 1015
Biblio:
REHM B., GCS 42 (1953).
9 19 § 1 (p.139, l.14 - /) BP2
11 7 § 2 (p.156, l.23 - /) BP2

3:9 In Danielem (1)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Commentary
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1873
Biblio:
BARDY G., LEFEVRE M., SC 14 (1947).
4 10 § 4 (p.280, l.29) BP2

3:10 Apocalypsis Petri graeca (eth.) (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 317
Biblio:
MAURER Ch., DUENSING H., in HENNECKE E., SCHNEEMELCHER W., Neutestamentliche Apokryphen, 2, Apostolisches, Apokalypsen und Verwandtes, 3e éd., Tübingen 1964, 472-483.
§ 5 (p.474, l.20) BP1

3:10 Clement of Alexandria Quis dives salvetur (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Sermon
Theme: Christian life
Clavis: 1379
Biblio:
STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., TREU U., 2e éd., GCS 17 (1970), 159-191.
36 § 3 (p.183, l.30) BP1

3:10 Clement of Rome (Ps) Recognitiones (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.400
Genre: Undetermined
Theme: Undetermined
Clavis: 1015
Biblio:
REHM B., GCS 51 (1965).
2 68 § 3 (p.92, l.4 - /) BP2

3:10 Hippolytus Capita contra Gaium (Apologia)* (2)
Date: ca.220 - ca.250
Genre: Fragment
Theme: Exegesis, Scripture Commentaries
Clavis: 1891
Biblio:
in DIONYSIVS BAR SALIBI, In Apocalypsim, SEDLACEK I., CSCO 60 (1910), 1 ; 2 ; 8-14 ; 19-20.
(p.8, l.32 - <) BP2
(p.9, l.21 - >) BP2

3:12 Apocalypsis Petri graeca (eth.) (2)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Revelation
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 317
Biblio:
MAURER Ch., DUENSING H., in HENNECKE E., SCHNEEMELCHER W., Neutestamentliche Apokryphen, 2, Apostolisches, Apokalypsen und Verwandtes, 3e éd., Tübingen 1964, 472-483.
§ 4 (p.473, l.32) BP1
§ 5 (p.474, l.20) BP1

3:12 Clement of Alexandria Quis dives salvetur (1)
Date: ca.190 - ca.215
Genre: Sermon
Theme: Christian life
Clavis: 1379
Biblio:
STAEHLIN O., FRUECHTEL L., TREU U., 2e éd., GCS 17 (1970), 159-191.
36 § 3 (p.183, l.30) BP1

3:15 De recta in Deum fide (1)
Date: ca.201 - ca.300
Genre: Dialogue
Theme: Heresy
Clavis: 1726
Biblio:
VAN DE SANDE BAKHUYZEN W.H., GCS 4 (1901).
(p.80, l.24 - <) BP2

3:16 Tertullian De ieiunio (aduersus psychicos) (1)
Date: ca.213 - ca.217
Genre: Treatise
Theme: Undetermined
Clavis: 29
Biblio:
REIFFERSCHEID A., WISSOWA G., CCL 2 (1954), 1257-1277.
11 § 1 (p.1269, l.1) BP1

3:18 Acta Petri graeca (1)
Date: ca.101 - ca.200
Genre: Acts
Theme: Apocrypha
Clavis: 190
Biblio:
39 (p.458, l.2) BP1
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Old 03-11-2013, 04:17 AM   #12
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Brown View Post
Hi Toto, as you requested, here is a link that might answer some of your objections:

http://bible.org/article/2-peter-peter%E2%80%99s
Ken, does it hurt you to do a search such as the following?

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=...2+epistlehl=en

You have a responsibility to look at the options out there rather than merely apologize for your beliefs. We generally don't care what you believe, but that you present ideas that are sound.

We do care, however, if you are attempting in some way to profess your faith. That's off limits here, a violation of the forum's rules.
Hi Spin, your link does not work. Is it against forum rules to profess a faith of unbelief? KB
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Old 03-11-2013, 04:36 AM   #13
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profess


2 to state openly that you have a particular belief, feeling, etc.


SYNONYM
DECLARE

profess something

He professed his admiration for their work.profess yourself + adjective
She professed herself satisfied with the progress so far.
3 profess something to belong to a particular religionto profess Christianity/Islam/Judaism

http://oald8.oxfordlearnersdictionar...onary/profess+



How could anyone try to win an argument if he/she is forbidden to state clearly what his argument is?
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Old 03-11-2013, 05:16 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Brown View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by spin View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Brown View Post
Hi Toto, as you requested, here is a link that might answer some of your objections:

http://bible.org/article/2-peter-peter%E2%80%99s
Ken, does it hurt you to do a search such as the following?

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=...2+epistlehl=en

You have a responsibility to look at the options out there rather than merely apologize for your beliefs. We generally don't care what you believe, but that you present ideas that are sound.

We do care, however, if you are attempting in some way to profess your faith. That's off limits here, a violation of the forum's rules.
Hi Spin, your link does not work. Is it against forum rules to profess a faith of unbelief? KB
Sorry, an ampersand got lost when I "neatened" the link:

http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=...+epistle&hl=en

The bolded section above is still applicable. The link is a good example of a place to start for reasonable analyses. Scholarly methodology is our aim. Stick with bible.org if it's not yours.
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Old 03-11-2013, 12:52 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakejonesiv View Post
The author (2Peter 2;20) seemingly takes a swipe at Montanism, another heresy that arose among the rural settlements of Asia Minor.
Hi Jake

Why is 2 Peter 2:20
Quote:
If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and are overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.
an attack on Montanism ?

The author of 2 Peter quite possibly knew about Montanism but I can't see any evidence in the letter that he opposed it.

Andrew Criddle
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Old 03-11-2013, 02:55 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewcriddle View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakejonesiv View Post
The author (2Peter 2;20) seemingly takes a swipe at Montanism, another heresy that arose among the rural settlements of Asia Minor.
Hi Jake

Why is 2 Peter 2:20
Quote:
If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and are overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning.
an attack on Montanism ?

The author of 2 Peter quite possibly knew about Montanism but I can't see any evidence in the letter that he opposed it.

Andrew Criddle
Andrew,

Typo. I meant 2 Peter 1:20-21.

Jake
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Old 03-11-2013, 03:12 PM   #17
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Andrew,

Typo. I meant 2 Peter 1:20-21.

Jake
Thanks

Andrew Criddle
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Old 03-11-2013, 06:44 PM   #18
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Quote:
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Hi aa5874, here is a quote from wiki answers.com, which I'm not sure is a reliable source, but it at least questions some of your erroneous assertions:

Quote:
Much of the late 19th Century skeptical scholarship has been dis-proven by more recent study. While at that time it may well have been a true statement that 'most critical scholars are skeptical' this is not the case today, with further study and a more balanced approach. The assumptions about the cultured language can simply be explained by Peter using a secretary, some suggesting that this was Silas. However, as stated above, he was clearly not ignorant as some allege to prove their theory, and so most likely was the author as claimed.
In addition to the above, since there are no undisputed works by Peter, it is difficult to make a judgment regarding his literary style as, for example, is made with various letters of Paul.

Thus with strong internal evidence, there is no reason to doubt Peter's authorship, especially considering the track record of the 19th Century 'scholars'.
KB
If you are not sure about the reliability of your source why make reference to it?? I find it extremely difficult to make an analysis of the excerpt you provided..
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Old 03-11-2013, 06:51 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by stephan huller View Post
References to 2 Peter before Origen according to biblindex..
Except for dated fragments every single date provided by you from bibllindex is either invented or assumed. Those dates are essentially of very little value.

By the way, Theophilus of Antioch did NOT make reference to 2nd Peter in To Autolycus III.

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N/A
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Old 03-11-2013, 08:16 PM   #20
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References to 2 Peter before Origen according to biblindex

N/A
How about unambiguous References to 2 Peter from sources demostrated to be before Origen verified by Stephan Huller? At least that list wouldn't contain 80%+ spew.
So you tell me, earliest attestation to 2 Peter by name in early Christian writers?
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