ph2ter

In some sense you may be correct, because you probably allude to the interpretation which says that Mithras is born from the cave, as David Ulansey explained in his book 'The Origins of the Mithraic Mysteries'. Caves are hollows within the rocky earth which suggest that the rock from which Mithras is born is meant to represent the Mithraic cave as seen from the outside. On the symbolical level a cave then represents the cosmos. But a cave surely represents also the womb.
Mithras is sometimes depicted as born of a rock by a river under a tree. (For example Catholic Encyclopedia complains that Mithras was not born in a cave but under a tree). This tree is surely a common mythological world tree which also represents the cosmos and which is analogous to David Ulansey's interpretation of the Mithraic cave. Branches of the world tree represents the heavens and its roots represents the underground. Caves are underground, so to put the place of his birth under a tree is exactly what I would expect. At Eleusis the temple has seats cut into the rock and is symbolically meant to be underground. Persephone gave birth also underground. Given all that I think that we can safely connect Mithras birth with a cave one way or another. Justin Martyr surely would not bring out Mithras in connection with the birth of Christ if similar story did not exist also in the mysteries of Mithras.

ph2ter

But some elemets exist also in the canonical Gospels. A rock hewn tomb in which Jesus was buried is analogous to the cave. Jesus' tomb was place of resurrection which in some sense can be interpreted as rebirth.
Some traces of Mithraic influence can also be found in Paul epistles. For example in 1 Corinthians Paul says:
10:1Now I would not have you ignorant, brothers, that our fathers were all under the cloud, and all passed through the sea; 10:2and were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 10:3and all ate the same spiritual food; 10:4and all drank the same spiritual drink. For they drank of a spiritual rock that followed them, and the rock was Christ.

I agree that this could be only a mere coincidence which stems from common symbolical heritage, but the Paul's Eucharistic formula may really be influenced by Mithraism.

GakuseiDon

But can we even say that Mithras was born from a cave? It seems that the most that can be said is that Mithras was formed from solid rock, and thus left behind a cave. But I don't think there is any literary evidence for that, just Ulansey's speculation.

This is where citing references become so necessary, since people tend to paraphrase sources to suit the meaning they want to see. Earlier you wrote "Also, Mithras is born in a cave, nobody denies that or I am not aware of." But in fact, we can't even say that Mithras was born, much less in a cave. Perhaps in your eagerness to find the parallel to Jesus being born in a cave, you have unconsciously phrased the sentence the way you did. While you may understand what you really mean, it wouldn't take much for someone else to repeat your sentence without the context behind it on another forum. And that is what happens a lot on the Internet.

That's curious. Why do they complain about that?

I think that if Justin knew a story where Mithras's "birth" was related to a cave, he would have mentioned it. He was eager to find the parallels between the Roman gods and Jesus. That he didn't mention it is an indication that he didn't know of such a story. He only says that the initiates of Mithras carried out ceremonies in places they called "caves".

As usual, Justin was trying to show that the myths relating to the Roman gods were ripped off versions of stories in the Old Testament. The Greeks and the Romans copied from Hebrew Scriptures!
http://www.earlychristianwritings.co...guetrypho.html

And when those who record the mysteries of Mithras say that he was begotten of a rock, and call the place where those who believe in him are initiated a cave, do I not perceive here that the utterance of Daniel, that a stone without hands was cut out of a great mountain, has been imitated by them, and that they have attempted likewise to imitate the whole of Isaiah's words?

ph2ter

Of corse that much about Mithraism will remain speculation because the mysteries of Mithras were supposed to remain hidden so we have no literary evidence or this evidence is scarce. But we have no reason to suspect that Mithras is really born out of the rock leaving cavity behind. The rock has its name and that name is 'petra genetrix' which means that he is really born. Also the symbolism is clear, the cave symbolizes the womb or the egg.

It says that 'Christ was born in a cave; and Mithraists worshipped in a cave, but Mithra was born under a tree near a river' under 'Relation to Christianity'.
I will dare to go even further.
The picture of the birth of Mithras under a tree near a river is identical to the Christian iconography of the cross. And that iconography is not common only in Mithraism and Christianity, but is common in all Indo-European and Semitic mythologies.
'The tree of Paradise is only a prefiguration of the cross and this cross is the centre of the world and of the drama of man's salvation. It towers from Golgotha to heaven, gathering the whole world together, and was set up in the same place where Adam was created, where he lies buried and where at the same hour of the same day the second Adam was to die; and at its foot there stream the four rivers of Paradise. These are the rivers of the mystery of baptism by means of which Adam's posterity obtains a new right to the ever green tree of life.' (taken from 'Greek myths and Christian mystery' by Hugo Rahner)

The world tree is symbolically identical to the cross. The Acts several times referenced to a cross as to a tree on which Jesus was hanging.
The tomb of Jesus is also close to the cross. John says that the tomb was in the 'garden' where the cross also stood:
Now in the place where he was crucified there was a garden, and in the garden a new tomb where no one had ever been laid. 19.42 So because of the Jewish day of Preparation, as the tomb was close at hand, they laid Jesus there.

Other evangelists say that the tomb was hewn in the rock.
The symbolism of rock can be found also in Matthew in connection with the resurrection:
And behold, the curtain of the temple was torn in two, from top to bottom; and the earth shook, and the rocks were split; 27.52 the tombs also were opened, and many bodies of the saints who had fallen asleep were raised, 27.53 and coming out of the tombs after his resurrection they went into the holy city and appeared to many.


He was not eager to find the parallels, but rather that parallels made troubles to him and that we can see from his attitude toward these parallels when he says that 'those who presided over the mysteries of Mithras were stirred up by the devil to say that in a place, called among them a cave, they were initiated by him'

He really didn't mention the place of Mithras birth.
But if that place was unknown to him how then he made the connection with Mithras? What devil were stirred up?

GakuseiDon

The devils that inspired the pagan poets to create myths that were ripped off versions of stories in the Old Testament. Justin's view was this: Christianity was not something new, but something old: much older than pagan beliefs, via its Jewish roots. To prove this, he tried to show parallels between pagan myths and the myths in the OT. The only trouble those parallels gave him was the work he had to do to find the parallels in the first place. (His excuse for why the parallels were so poor: the devils misunderstood the OT).

aa5874

It is not really true at all that Justin based his parallels between the OT and pagan myths.


The Eucharist is not from the OT, based on Justin, it can be found in the memoirs of the apostles called Gospels.

This is Justin Martyr in First Apology LXVI
And this food is called among us Eukaristia [the Eucharist], of which no one is allowed to partake but the man who believes that the things which we teach are true, and who has been washed with the washing that is for the remission of sins, and unto regeneration, and who is so living as Christ has enjoined.

For not as common bread and common drink do we receive these; but in like manner as Jesus Christ our Saviour, having been made flesh by the Word of God, had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so likewise have we been taught that the food which is blessed by the prayer of His word, and from which our blood and flesh by transmutation are nourished, is the flesh and blood of that Jesus who was made flesh.

For the apostles, in the memoirs composed by them, which are called Gospels, have thus delivered unto us what was enjoined upon them; that Jesus took bread, and when He had given thanks, said, "This do ye in remembrance of Me, this is My body;" and that, after the same manner, having taken the cup and given thanks, He said, "This is My blood;" and gave it to them alone. Which the wicked devils have imitated in the mysteries of Mithras, commanding the same thing to be done. For, that bread and a cup of water are placed with certain incantations in the mystic rites of one who is being initiated, you either know or can learn[/quote]


The crucifixion, resurrection and ascension of Jesus are not found in the OT.

Excerpts from Justin Martyr's First ApologyXX1 Justin Martyr did make parallels between paganism and memoirs of the apostles.