Freethought & Rationalism Archive

seebs · 10-06-2003, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Solanalos
Following my original direction for this inquiry into Christian 'mechanics', I need to expand the OP to include a couple of other questions.

Along with "What is worship?", a necessary query "Does God demand worship from a person for that person to enter heaven?" needs to be answered before I can continue with my idea.

Are there any Christians on this forum who can answer these for me?

I don't know that you can get a consistent answer. Keep in mind the old saying "He who sings, prays twice". It has been argued that moral behavior is *in and of itself* worshipful, as is the creation of beauty, or the appreciation of the world.

I don't think God demands any kind of formal obesiance, but different people have different opinions on this issue.

seebs · 10-06-2003, 01:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Singerian
If it makes you happy, you get pleasure out of it.

If God is a subject infinitely worthy of consideration, as insisted on by theists, he should've created human worshipping machines. In fact, it was unethical not to.

If they were just worshipping machines, they wouldn't be human...

That said, this is the place in the cosmology generally assumed to be occupied by angels.

winstonjen · 10-06-2003, 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by seebs
That said, this is the place in the cosmology generally assumed to be occupied by angels.

That doesn't make sense. If the angels were worshipping machines, how did 1/3 of them rebel?

seebs · 10-06-2003, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by winstonjen
That doesn't make sense. If the angels were worshipping machines, how did 1/3 of them rebel?

Dunno. Given that the entire "angels rebelled" thing is, so far as I can tell, a human invention that fills our need to tell certain kinds of stories, I'm not sure I need to have an answer. I like to toy with the question of what, exactly, is going on there, but it turns out I don't need to know.

winstonjen · 10-06-2003, 01:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by seebs
Dunno. Given that the entire "angels rebelled" thing is, so far as I can tell, a human invention that fills our need to tell certain kinds of stories, I'm not sure I need to have an answer. I like to toy with the question of what, exactly, is going on there, but it turns out I don't need to know.

OK, then who is the 'ultimate enemy' that god has to defeat? Or is the whole Revelations thing another fabrication?

seebs · 10-06-2003, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by winstonjen
OK, then who is the 'ultimate enemy' that god has to defeat? Or is the whole Revelations thing another fabrication?

Or metaphor, or analogy. I have seen cogent-looking arguments that Revelations is an allegory for the specific issues facing the early church in the first century, written as an allegory because the author was in a Roman prison at the time, and that none of it was meant to be taken in any other context. I'm not inclined to spend a lot of time groveling through it hoping to stumble on something I can make sense of; too many conflicting interpretations, and it all seems decidedly irrelevant to the question of how to go about one's daily life.

livius drusus · 10-06-2003, 04:32 AM

God and worship, please. Ultimate enemies and robot angels get their own thread. In fact, I think they'd make a great thread and one of y'all should totally start it.

Wayne Delia · 10-06-2003, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
A fellowship with His creation. He doesn't need worship, He justs wants to love His creation, and be loved in return.

Wouldn't the same result occur if God were to worship us? (No kidding.)

WMD

Kandeda Trefil · 10-06-2003, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Solanalos
What is worship?

WORSHIP is PR@ISE. Hidden within the mix of letters in PR@ISE is a hint of what "it's all about." Is PR@ISE ritualistic? Is PR@ISE repetitious? Therefore, is PR@ISE boring? The same old song, mindlessly repeated in hopes of some advantage? :boohoo: Do many intelligent, truth-seeking minds have an almost allergic reaction to boredom? PR@ISE is to a sense of security what R@PE IS to a power monger. Always look

for the hidden meaning!

Magus55 · 10-06-2003, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Thanks for the reply.

Before this thread gets any larger, I feel we need a mutual definition of worship. This will dispel miscommunication and allow everyone involved to comment in reference to the same idea. I, personally, am bedazzled as to what people are actually 'doing' when they are worshipping.

What is worship?

Worship is defined as reverence towards a divine being.

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10-06-2003, 04:32 AM	#17
livius drusus Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Selva Oscura Posts: 4,120	God and worship, please. Ultimate enemies and robot angels get their own thread. In fact, I think they'd make a great thread and one of y'all should totally start it.

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