Freethought & Rationalism Archive

gstafleu · 01-19-2007, 09:09 AM

Whatever they are, spiritual beings and/or messengers, how are the different from (subordinate) gods?

Gerard Stafleu

spin · 01-19-2007, 09:53 AM

What exactly are angels?

Second class deities. (I can't call them gods, we're monotheistic these days.)

spin

Chaupoline · 01-19-2007, 09:56 AM

Angels see themselves as the Sons of God. They interacted directly with humanity in an attempt to domesticate us toward what they believed was the greater good. In many ways them seem like what UFO-ologists claim to be aliens.

John Kesler · 01-19-2007, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstafleu

Whatever they are, spiritual beings and/or messengers, how are the different from (subordinate) gods?

The concept of angels fits better within a monotheistic framework:

Quote:

Deuteronomy 32:8 (NRSV)
8 When the Most High apportioned the nations,when he divided humankind, he fixed the boundaries of the peoples according to the number of the gods;

Deuteronomy 32:8 (Brenton's LXX)
8 When the Most High divided the nations, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the nations according to the number of the angels of God.

Ben C Smith · 01-19-2007, 10:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spin

Second class deities. (I can't call them gods, we're monotheistic these days.)

So you call them deities in order to avoid calling them gods?

Kind of like calling someone a robber in order to avoid calling him a thief.

Ben.

Malachi151 · 01-19-2007, 10:18 AM

To me seeing images of Jesus surrounded by angels is just like seeing Jesus riding on a centaur. It's so straight out of Greek mythology.

spamandham · 01-19-2007, 10:36 AM

The concept of an angel does not originate in the Hebrew scriptures. They simply borrowed pre-existing concepts. In early theism, the gods were thought to be what we might call superheroes. They were basically humans with special abilities who lived in the sky.

Since they were basically human, they ate, they were petty like humans, they had sex with humans, etc. The idea of wings, staircases, ladders, flying carpets, flying chariots, etc., were all invented to resolve the problem of how the gods travelled back and forth from earth to the sky where they lived.

The reason the gods lived in the sky is because early theism was born out of primitive astronomy, whereby the star clusters were used to identify the proper times for planting, harvest, and herd migration. The star clusters were eventually anthropomorphized, and the gods were born.

nightwyrm · 01-19-2007, 01:05 PM

Hot chicks with wings in skimpy clothing.

Toto · 01-19-2007, 01:31 PM

The angels in the Bible were all male, and none had wings. But they may have been hot. In each period of art history, angels tend to be represented as whatever the culture considered desireable. (That may just be because that's what the artists liked to paint, and art collectors liked to draw.)

Toto · 01-19-2007, 01:37 PM

Please note that this thread was resurrected from 3 years ago, and some of the posters in the first part have not been around lately.

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01-19-2007, 09:09 AM	#11
gstafleu Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: London, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,719	Whatever they are, spiritual beings and/or messengers, how are the different from (subordinate) gods? Gerard Stafleu

01-19-2007, 09:53 AM	#12
spin Contributor Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: nowhere Posts: 15,747	What exactly are angels? Second class deities. (I can't call them gods, we're monotheistic these days.) spin

01-19-2007, 09:56 AM	#13
Chaupoline Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: USA Posts: 1,441	Angels see themselves as the Sons of God. They interacted directly with humanity in an attempt to domesticate us toward what they believed was the greater good. In many ways them seem like what UFO-ologists claim to be aliens.

01-19-2007, 10:18 AM	#16
Malachi151 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Colorado Posts: 8,674	To me seeing images of Jesus surrounded by angels is just like seeing Jesus riding on a centaur. It's so straight out of Greek mythology.

01-19-2007, 10:36 AM	#17
spamandham Contributor Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 11,525	The concept of an angel does not originate in the Hebrew scriptures. They simply borrowed pre-existing concepts. In early theism, the gods were thought to be what we might call superheroes. They were basically humans with special abilities who lived in the sky. Since they were basically human, they ate, they were petty like humans, they had sex with humans, etc. The idea of wings, staircases, ladders, flying carpets, flying chariots, etc., were all invented to resolve the problem of how the gods travelled back and forth from earth to the sky where they lived. The reason the gods lived in the sky is because early theism was born out of primitive astronomy, whereby the star clusters were used to identify the proper times for planting, harvest, and herd migration. The star clusters were eventually anthropomorphized, and the gods were born.

01-19-2007, 01:05 PM	#18
nightwyrm Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Toronto Posts: 1,083	Hot chicks with wings in skimpy clothing.

01-19-2007, 01:31 PM	#19
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	The angels in the Bible were all male, and none had wings. But they may have been hot. In each period of art history, angels tend to be represented as whatever the culture considered desireable. (That may just be because that's what the artists liked to paint, and art collectors liked to draw.)

01-19-2007, 01:37 PM	#20
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Please note that this thread was resurrected from 3 years ago, and some of the posters in the first part have not been around lately.

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