Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Chili · 05-28-2007, 05:19 AM

He is telling us that the unexamined life is not worth living.

The fig tree equals our own herritage that is contained in our soul wherein we have the reign of God also called the Thousand Year Reign. It is the image of God wherein we are created and have been formed and to which we must return before we can actually be the man that we were created to be.

So first the fig tree must cause us to be reborn (if that is an acceptable term) and after that it must nourish us to maturity without ever a preacher hollering from the pulpit.

wordy · 05-28-2007, 05:42 AM

Didn't one text in the Gospels say that it was a parable and not something really happening. A kind of metaphor for something else or more likely a text in the Old Testament that "Jesus" or those writing the story about Jesus doing a Midrash on the old text and applying it on the new situation but portraying it as if it did happen to a real person with real disciples walking there in a historic place.

What they try to say is beyond my imagination.

It could refer to that to be part of the Kingdom of God is to bear fruit even if it is not season for bearing fruit. To always put the kingdom first and the earthly matters last. The Fig tree a symbol for following prescribed times for when to be of use for God.

It could be a simile to the reaping of ax on the Sabbath, Jesus and the Disciples as humans are more important to God than old prescribed rules of behavior, it is the spirit of the law not the letter of the law that is the important here. To eat when your hungry is more in line with God's will than to not eat cause the Law forbid you cause it is not right to "work" on a Sabbath.

It shows that the writers of the Jesus myth wanted to instill a rebellion perspective that your individual interpretation of God's will is more important than the official "corrupted" by Kings loyal to Rome?

I'm only guessing, is there any chance we could guess what they wanted to achieve? I doubt it. Too far away in time and mentality.

ahdenai · 05-28-2007, 03:04 PM

He was a spoiled child, didn't get what he wanted and had a temper tantrum. His immaturity is also shown in his approach to the money-changers.

wordy · 05-29-2007, 05:33 AM

The story about the prodigal son could be Jesus telling a true story about his behavior during the lost years from 20 to 30. He was spoiled indeed. A mother who expected him to become the savior of her people. Not easy to live under such pressure so he dropped out to be alone for some ten years.

Loomis · 05-29-2007, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malachi151

In Mark and Matthew, Jesus curses a fig tree and it dies. What does this relate to? I'm assuming that this has something to do with some midrash of the time.

Hi Malachi151. :wave:

Just to remind you in advance - I’m an atheist.

Fwiw, I think there is an excellent discussion of this subject on this thread on another forum. :blush:

wordy · 05-30-2007, 12:46 AM

that thread also say it was a parable but Mark retell it as if it was a real event.

Which support the view that all stories about Jesus in reality is Old Testament texts played out or acted out by Midrash interpretation of the scripture.

Chili · 05-30-2007, 04:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wordy

The story about the prodigal son could be Jesus telling a true story about his behavior during the lost years from 20 to 30. He was spoiled indeed. A mother who expected him to become the savior of her people. Not easy to live under such pressure so he dropped out to be alone for some ten years.

The story of Jesus actually begins after the homecoming of the prodigal son which makes reference to Joseph who was led to his native land (home town) to give an account of himself there.

The time Jesus spend on earth was only 42 months as Nazarite in Galilee where his world was brought to an end before he could enter Israel proper. Of this time the appearance that Mary dropped out is to show the free will offering by the persona of the persona to be crucified which is exactly how "her people" are saved as the new Jerusalem.

"Who is my mother" in "these are my brothers and sisters"?

05-28-2007, 03:04 PM	#33
ahdenai Veteran Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: migrant worker, US Posts: 2,845	What does Jesus cursing the fig tree mean He was a spoiled child, didn't get what he wanted and had a temper tantrum. His immaturity is also shown in his approach to the money-changers.

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05-28-2007, 05:19 AM	#31
Chili Banned Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Alberta Posts: 11,885	He is telling us that the unexamined life is not worth living. The fig tree equals our own herritage that is contained in our soul wherein we have the reign of God also called the Thousand Year Reign. It is the image of God wherein we are created and have been formed and to which we must return before we can actually be the man that we were created to be. So first the fig tree must cause us to be reborn (if that is an acceptable term) and after that it must nourish us to maturity without ever a preacher hollering from the pulpit.

05-28-2007, 05:42 AM	#32
wordy Contributor Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sweden, Europe Posts: 12,091	Didn't one text in the Gospels say that it was a parable and not something really happening. A kind of metaphor for something else or more likely a text in the Old Testament that "Jesus" or those writing the story about Jesus doing a Midrash on the old text and applying it on the new situation but portraying it as if it did happen to a real person with real disciples walking there in a historic place. What they try to say is beyond my imagination. It could refer to that to be part of the Kingdom of God is to bear fruit even if it is not season for bearing fruit. To always put the kingdom first and the earthly matters last. The Fig tree a symbol for following prescribed times for when to be of use for God. It could be a simile to the reaping of ax on the Sabbath, Jesus and the Disciples as humans are more important to God than old prescribed rules of behavior, it is the spirit of the law not the letter of the law that is the important here. To eat when your hungry is more in line with God's will than to not eat cause the Law forbid you cause it is not right to "work" on a Sabbath. It shows that the writers of the Jesus myth wanted to instill a rebellion perspective that your individual interpretation of God's will is more important than the official "corrupted" by Kings loyal to Rome? I'm only guessing, is there any chance we could guess what they wanted to achieve? I doubt it. Too far away in time and mentality.

05-29-2007, 05:33 AM	#34
wordy Contributor Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sweden, Europe Posts: 12,091	The story about the prodigal son could be Jesus telling a true story about his behavior during the lost years from 20 to 30. He was spoiled indeed. A mother who expected him to become the savior of her people. Not easy to live under such pressure so he dropped out to be alone for some ten years.

05-30-2007, 12:46 AM	#36
wordy Contributor Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sweden, Europe Posts: 12,091	that thread also say it was a parable but Mark retell it as if it was a real event. Which support the view that all stories about Jesus in reality is Old Testament texts played out or acted out by Midrash interpretation of the scripture.

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