Originally Posted by Jay GW

Have a question debated guy from Syria who says "everyone here knows Jesus was real. He lived here."

There's no contemporary account. Everything known comes after the dates he is claimed to have lived. Second, the story of his life mirrors every messiah myth from several religions. Coincidence or not.

Originally Posted by storytime

But I'm more interested in why Jewish rabbi's thought him to be an actual person in their hatred of him. I read somewhere on a website that the Talmud says that Jesus was an illegitimate son of a Roman soldier and thus give creditability to a man named Jesus in denying his Jewishness? Why, if Jesus wasn't real, would those rabbi's have argued against him as being anything special like the son of God? Would they dare even mention him if they thought he was a mythical character? Why didn't the Jewish rabbi's write in their Talmud that Jesus was a mythical character invented by Gentile church fathers? But they didn't do that did they? So, the "evidence" from the Jewish rabbi's as they wrote in their Talmud, is that Jesus was a real person, not pure fiction. How do you counter their non-denial of Jesus the Jew?

Originally Posted by spamandham

Jesus supposedly existed around 30CE. Rabbinic Judaism didn't begin until the mid 2nd century. There is 120 year time gap as a minimum.

Why wouldn't they assume he was a real person, even if he wasn't?

Originally Posted by storytime

Then they relied on heresay?

Originally Posted by IamJoseph

The writings in the talmud may not refer to the Gospel person of Jesus - it is coded from the Romans, contains a most common name in Judea, and has no dates attached. It could refer to a Joshua 150 year prior. There is no reason for Jews not to dislike what the Jesus figure represents - millions were murdered in this name, although these crimes were commited not by any Jesus but the church representing him. One must look at both sides of the coin. I saw no good features in the Gospel version of Jesus, and cannot fathom what he said or did which was honorable or praise worthy - give some examples?

Originally Posted by spamandham

What else did they have? Neither Jesus nor any eyewitnesses were alive.

Anyone living in those days of magic and superstition, would read the Gospel and natuarlly think Jesus had actually lived - and had really performed all the miracles as well. Even most of the philosophers - the best educated and most reasoned of their society - accepted the idea that gods really existed and magically interferred in this world.

Originally Posted by storytime

You're right Joseph. MILLIONS and MILLIONS have been murdered in Jesus name just as BILLIONS and BILLIONS have been murdered in Yahweh's name. "God" is a bloodthirsty tyrant with a death-cult following.

Originally Posted by aa5874

Who wrote about Jesus behind the NT?

Originally Posted by Vinnie

So the Jesus of the NT did not exist, what about the Jesus behind the NT?

Vinnie

Originally Posted by dog-on

Here you have a problem. Do you have a reference for Jesus that does not in some way relate to the gospel stories and/or epistles?

I, personally have never seen one.

This being the case, one could say, you have no evidence whatsoever for a "Jesus behind the NT".

Of course, you could simply make one up.