spin

I'm going to suffer from repetitive stress keeping up here.

Look at Romans 7:1-3 and tell me if GBRH can possibly mean father.

The law has dominion over a gbr)

And if, while her husband b(lh is alive, she should adhere to another man gbr, she would become an adulteress: but if her husband b(lh should die, she is freed from the law; and would not be an adulteress though joined to another man gbr)

Well, can gbr) possibly indicate "father" here, hmmm?

Look at 1 Cor 7:3-14. The translator does it frequently. (7:3 man {GBRH} to woman... woman to lord {B(LH}, ie "husband" and "wife" in both cases.)

judge won't look at these. He didn't last time.

ETA: And note I did deal with Mt 7:9 earlier in citing a previous response to the same stuff.


spin

judge

Of course I looked at them. But stop for a minute and look at what I wrote in this thread.

Gowra can mean husband. A husband is the male head of the household. Kinsman has also been suggested as a good translation also.

But what does it mean in this context?

MATTHEW 1:16-19

Joseph, mary's husband is her baala.

There is another man, another kinsman, another male head of the household mentioned, but he is not Mary's baala he is Mary's gowra

There two men, two josephs in Mary's family. One is her Father and one is her husband.

Two different words are used in Aramaic to distinguish them. gowra and baala. Both words mean man.

spin

<edit>

You said they both mean "man". Treat them as such and your case falls apart.

As you still refuse to deal with what I post, I'll have to do so myself (Rom 7:3):

Try it, see if you like it. But you don't respond to the evidence a person posts. Your last response was simply another example of your not responding.

Despite your conjecture that there were two Josephs in Mary's life, her husband and her father, it is merely your wayward assertion that gbr) must mean "father" that you offer to support your conjecture. When shown that there is a normal word for "father", )b), "abba", and that there are examples where gbr) simply cannot mean "father", you just umm, pass over these as not conducive to your little game.


spin

judge

Spin, stop a minute and think about it.

If the Joseph in verse 16 was the same as the joseph in verse 19 the verses would read

and Jacob the father of Joseph, the gowra of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

17Thus there were fourteen generations in all from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ.
The Birth of Jesus Christ
This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husbandgowra was a righteous man and did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

Or it might read ...
and Jacob the father of Joseph, the baala of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

17Thus there were fourteen generations in all from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ.
The Birth of Jesus Christ
This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husbandbaala was a righteous man and did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

But instead it reads...

and Jacob the father of Joseph, the gowra of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

17Thus there were fourteen generations in all from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ.
The Birth of Jesus Christ
This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph, but before they came together, she was found to be with child through the Holy Spirit. Because Joseph her husbandbaala was a righteous man and did not want to expose her to public disgrace, he had in mind to divorce her quietly.

What you fail to explain is why these two different words are used, baala and gowra.


What you fail to explain is why if gowra is Ok here...

Matthew 7:9

Which man/gowra among you, if his son asks for bread, will give him a stone?

Why not in Matthew 1:19?

All the best.

spin

If Jesus says that he's come to set a man gbr) against his father )bwhy, Mt 10:35, then you must need to stop yourself and consider the proposition you are trying to sell as being on extremely shakey ground.

Your constant missing the point with Mt 7:9 doesn't help your case either. If a say "a doctor had a son", you wouldn't dare say that "doctor" meant "father". It just so happens that the doctor was a father and the man was a father, but it's not derivable from him being a doctor, or a man. Your logic is false.

I have already thought about Mt 1:16. This is a reference to Joseph before Mary was married to him. They were betrothed by 1:18 and married by 1:19. b(lh tends to be used in situations specific to marriage, while gbr) meaning man can be used in that context, but is a more generic term.

Anything else?


spin

judge

Sure

Using your method we still end up with one generation less than we should have.

3X14 = 42

As I mention all the contradictions are resolved by this one word.
There are many contradictions in the bible but this just aint one.

Have a good day.

spin

Oh the repetitive stress. :banghead:

You don't make one error to resolve another. You don't fabricate a significance for a word just to suit the fact that you have the need to explain a problem whose cause you don't know. Get the difficulty?

By the way, as Mt is dealing with generations, ie fatherings, the first group still only has 13 generations: you don't count Abraham as a generation. (If you include Abraham at the beginning of the first series of generations, then you have to include David twice and Jeconiah twice, as they also start the second and third series, and you end up with 14, 15, 14.) However, why do you require the author to have been so accurate as to give you the perfection you want from him?

Remember, fabricating the significance of a word is just a flub and you don't make one error to resolve another.
You don't make one error to resolve another.
You don't make one error to resolve another.
You don't make one error to resolve another.
Got it?

Now I think we've rehearsed it all. Anything you've forgotten, before you can file it in the to be repeated ad nauseum tray?


spin

judge

Yes you do put yourself thru a lot. Why?


Gobblede gook!

Look spin here they are.


1A record of the genealogy of Jesus Christ the son of David, the son of Abraham:
2Abraham was the father of Isaac, 1
Isaac the father of Jacob, 2
Jacob the father of Judah and his brothers, 3
3Judah the father of Perez and Zerah, whose mother was Tamar, 4
Perez the father of Hezron, 5
Hezron the father of Ram, 6
4Ram the father of Amminadab, 7
Amminadab the father of Nahshon, 8
Nahshon the father of Salmon, 9
5Salmon the father of Boaz, whose mother was Rahab, 10
Boaz the father of Obed, whose mother was Ruth, 11
Obed the father of Jesse, 13
6and Jesse the father of King David. 14
David was the father of Solomon, whose mother had been Uriah's wife, 1
7Solomon the father of Rehoboam, 2
Rehoboam the father of Abijah, 3
Abijah the father of Asa, 4
8Asa the father of Jehoshaphat, 5
Jehoshaphat the father of Jehoram, 6
Jehoram the father of Uzziah, 7
9Uzziah the father of Jotham, 8
Jotham the father of Ahaz, 9
Ahaz the father of Hezekiah, 10
10Hezekiah the father of Manasseh, 11
Manasseh the father of Amon, 12
Amon the father of Josiah, 13
11and Josiah the father of Jeconiah[a] and his brothers at the time of the exile to Babylon. 14
12After the exile to Babylon:
Jeconiah was the father of Shealtiel, 1
Shealtiel the father of Zerubbabel, 2
13Zerubbabel the father of Abiud, 3
Abiud the father of Eliakim, 4
Eliakim the father of Azor, 5
14Azor the father of Zadok, 6
Zadok the father of Akim, 7
Akim the father of Eliud, 8
15Eliud the father of Eleazar, 9
Eleazar the father of Matthan, 10
Matthan the father of Jacob, 11
16and Jacob the father of Joseph,12 the husband (should this read father?) of Mary,13 of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ. 14
17Thus there were fourteen generations in all from Abraham to David, fourteen from David to the exile to Babylon, and fourteen from the exile to the Christ.

Chris Weimer

Actually, he says that Matthew wrote down the logia of Jesus Christ in a Hebrew dialect. That does not tell us that the current Gospel of Matthew part of the Christian canon is indeed what he was talking about, and face it judge, evidence points contrary.

Too bad you look afterwards.

spin

I guess I shouldn't try to show you the errors of your way.

Umm,

"Boaz the father of Obed, whose mother was Ruth, 11
Obed the father of Jesse, 13"

Shouldn't that be umm,... 11, 12 there, judge? Or am I committing the faux pas of pointing out that you've got a finger missing?


spin