Freethought & Rationalism Archive

EarlDoherty · 05-22-2012, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Carr

Quote:

Originally Posted by hjalti

And the personal attacks on "Blogger Godfrey" were astonishing. They both mention a specific quote:
I don't even have to look the quote up, but I'm certain "Blogger Godfrey" is just saying that in his work he doesn't deal with books.

http://vridar.wordpress.com/2010/09/...ake-look-like/

''I’m a librarian, but I never see or touch a book. I work in a field that seeks to deliver electronic or digital resources to users online.'

In other words, a misrepresentation of what Godfrey said. Typical dirty pool.

Phoney scholarship and a lack of integrity. Pretty potent combination.

Earl Doherty

Sheshbazzar · 05-22-2012, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Phoney scholarship and a lack of integrity.

Christianity.

stephan huller · 05-22-2012, 04:23 PM

And those fucking bloggers that venerate Casey and his concubine - Jim West, the Fat Guy, that idiot who thinks that Mark was written when dinosaurs roamed the earth and that man-housewife that runs the Biblioblog Library. They deliberately kept Godfrey out of their little fraternity. Apparently Godfrey is a conspiracy theorist.

Diogenes the Cynic · 05-22-2012, 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by James The Least

Casey: "(Robert M.) Price’s treatment of New Testament narratives has two other major features conventional among mythicists. One is to continue with conservative or even fundamentalist exegesis. For example, he discusses Mark 9.1: ‘Amen I say to you that there are some of those standing here who will not taste of death until they have seen the kingdom of God come in power.’ Price declares that ‘all interpreters admit that this prediction must have the Parousia in mind.’ All interpreters have not adopted this incorrect exegesis for the very good reason that the saying mentions the kingdom of God, an important feature of the teaching of Jesus, whereas belief in the Parousia was created by the early church after Jesus’ death."

A fine example of how "critical scholarship" easily elides into apologetics. The Kingdom of God can only come from the authentic teachings of the historic Jesus. There's no possibility that it, like the Parousia, was invented by evangelists, irrespective of whether or not a historic Jesus existed.

All Casey is really saying here is that Parousia is not the only possible interpretation, and that the Kingdom theme, authentic or not, is a separate one from the parousia.

Solo · 05-22-2012, 06:27 PM

Reply to Steph Fisher's essay on the Oxonian: (repost)

It seems there are only two kinds of students of the NT texts in Ms Fisher's world: unassailable scholarly sages and 'self-promoting pedlars of incompetence' with 'total inability to understand'. Some of her deep thoughts and sommersaults in logic are truly a thing to behold:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephanie.L. Fisher

Cohn was a German Jew who emigrated to Israel, where he became Attorney General of Israel, and Minister of Justice,....
He was a member of the “T’hila” Movement for Israeli Jewish
secularism. It is culturally ludicrous to expect anyone like Cohn to
give a fair account of a New Testament narrative, especially one
which has played such an appalling role in the history of Christian
anti-Semitism. "

Not at all clear what Ms. Fisher finds in Mr Cohn credentials that makes it "culturally ludicrous" to expect an intelligent - independent - view of NT from him. Lost a connecting thread perhaps ? Another triple salto with a sure-footed landing:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephanie.L. Fisher

Are [the synoptics] pristine, objective, verbatim accounts of the life of Jesus? Hardly. Are they infused with assumptions about who Jesus is and approximations of what he said? Yes. Can we find “heresiological”, or more properly controversial material in
them—material intended to defend a sketchy proto-orthodox teaching about Jesus against less acceptable beliefs? Of course—as John Fenton showed,especially in relation to Matthew’s gospel. These considerations, however, are the surest proof that Jesus really lived and that the preservers of the Jesus-tradition knew what they were defending: they were squeamish about the divine man Christology [sic] that dominated in much of the church, and is at least “available” in the gospel of John. "

It is precisely this type of vacuous rhetoric that invites deep skepticism if not outright scorn. Why should this kind of "surest proof" sway me one inch from believing the gospels to be allegoric narratives, or as Jan Wojcik called them, samples of "narrative gnosticism" ? Why should I not read Ms. Fisher's method of reading the texts, an excellent illustration of what A.N. Whitehead called "the fallacy of misplaced concreteness"? Why was Jesus first not an agreed- on form of personifying what the early Christ visionaries believed was the holy spirit of God that was abroad announcing the end of times ? Is it because Steph Fisher's mentor invented yet another form of a (not yet) academically vetted testimonial that Jesus walked on earth and was recorded early in yet another non-existent, unprovable screed, tablet or plurality thereof ? Why should I take them seriously when the best they can do is self-serving pap like :

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maurice Casey

I hope...that the forthcoming book by Stephanie Fisher will establish it (a new theory of gospel sourcing) beyond reasonable doubt as the normative view of New Testament
scholars. (Jesus, p. 80)

"A normative view of NT scholars" ? This statement best testifies to a seriously impaired sense of not just academic standards (since when one comments on as-yet unpublished work ?) but an elementary struggle with reality. Ms Fisher so far overwhelms only the intellectually destitute with her wayward Jesus Process of thinking, to wit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephanie.L. Fisher

All competent and critical New Testament scholars investigating the history of early Christianity, should be competent in methodology in order to pursue academic enquiry.

Mind-boggling.

Best,
Jiri

stephan huller · 05-22-2012, 06:44 PM

At least casey got where he is legitimately

Minimalist · 05-22-2012, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephanie.L. Fisher

All competent and critical New Testament scholars investigating the history of early Christianity, should be competent in methodology in order to pursue academic enquiry.

At least she didn't come right out and say "they have to agree with me."

stephan huller · 05-22-2012, 07:03 PM

She is among the most horrible people on the earth

stephan huller · 05-22-2012, 07:31 PM

I just want everyone to know that if this was a field dominated by unattractive females I could have slept my way to the top

stephan huller · 05-22-2012, 07:37 PM

In fact I demand that universities hire an equal number of unattractive females to allow for talentless males such as myself have a chance of becoming "serious academics"

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05-22-2012, 04:23 PM	#33
stephan huller Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 9,337	And those fucking bloggers that venerate Casey and his concubine - Jim West, the Fat Guy, that idiot who thinks that Mark was written when dinosaurs roamed the earth and that man-housewife that runs the Biblioblog Library. They deliberately kept Godfrey out of their little fraternity. Apparently Godfrey is a conspiracy theorist.

05-22-2012, 06:44 PM	#36
stephan huller Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 9,337	At least casey got where he is legitimately

05-22-2012, 07:03 PM	#38
stephan huller Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 9,337	She is among the most horrible people on the earth

05-22-2012, 07:31 PM	#39
stephan huller Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 9,337	I just want everyone to know that if this was a field dominated by unattractive females I could have slept my way to the top

05-22-2012, 07:37 PM	#40
stephan huller Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 9,337	In fact I demand that universities hire an equal number of unattractive females to allow for talentless males such as myself have a chance of becoming "serious academics"

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