Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Chris Weimer · 09-25-2005, 05:33 PM

Truly, judge, I've contemplated it. But I might just settle for putting you on ignore and let spin waste his time.

spin · 09-25-2005, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Weimer

Truly, judge, I've contemplated it. But I might just settle for putting you on ignore and let spin waste his time.

Hey, shite. You can't do that, Christof! Christof, rhymes with... with... oh, forget it.

judge is a man of such effluence! How could you?

(By the way, which is the ignore button?)

spin

CJD · 09-26-2005, 05:45 AM

When I wrote "I promise not to take myself too seriously," I didn't mean ignore me!

Rick Sumner · 09-26-2005, 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spin

In the book of 1 Enoch, really a collection of works, we find the mention of "the son of man" with an apocalyptic overtone in a section referred to as the Parables (or Similitudes). The whole section is missing from the Dead Sea Scrolls and the other parts of 1 Enoch circulated individually as the manuscripts indicate. Our copy of 1 Enoch which includes the Parables is actually a very late text in Ethiopic. The editor of the Qumran Enoch texts, Josef Milik, argues that the Parables was quite a late writing.

Milik argues for an extraordinarily late date (c.270 CE). Charlesworth suggests that a dating in the first century BCE or first century CE is not improbable. Neither of them really have any substantiative evidence for such a dating. About all we can conclude with a reasonable degree of safety is that it was probably written after the DSS.

Regards,
Rick Sumner

Chris Weimer · 09-27-2005, 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spin

(By the way, which is the ignore button?)

In their profiles...

yalla · 09-28-2005, 10:19 AM

psst Notsri

You seem to know stuff that may give me an answer to an unanswered question.
When was the title "rabbi'' first used in Judaism?
I can't find a simple answer anywhere.
Basically I just want to know if the term was used pre 70 CE or not?
Please respond- simply.

CJD · 09-28-2005, 12:21 PM

yalla, the title was apparently first used for those leaders or patriarchs of the Sanhedrin in the first century ce. The Mishnah mentions it too. That's about all I know on this subject.

Now, on to my purpose for re-posting:

Let it be known that no listener of Jesus on the Mount of Olives as recorded in the Synoptics would have expected to see Jesus literally descending on literal clouds. I don't ever want to see another post here that suggests otherwise.

CJD

Dharma · 09-28-2005, 12:49 PM

there are two strands of the concept of the "son of man":

1) Jewish one - where the son of man is an ordinary weak human.
2) The Son of Man as super hero does come more from the "indo European", where Manu, the first Man is hero and king -- both the story of Ezekiel riding chariots to heaven and this story's association with Syria (where the Vedic Mitanni ruled and introduced war chariots and chariot warfare to the middle east ) is perhaps the biggest indication of this influence.

spin · 09-28-2005, 01:03 PM

In Jer 41:1 there is a great, rby, of the king called Ishmael. It's sometimes mistranslated, but it's there.

I just have to find the willpower to deal with your post, CJD

spin

CJD · 09-29-2005, 10:02 AM

I understand, really. I tend to blather on and on and … on …

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09-25-2005, 05:33 PM	#41
Chris Weimer Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: none Posts: 9,879	Truly, judge, I've contemplated it. But I might just settle for putting you on ignore and let spin waste his time.

09-26-2005, 05:45 AM	#43
CJD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: greater Orlando area Posts: 832	When I wrote "I promise not to take myself too seriously," I didn't mean ignore me!

09-28-2005, 10:19 AM	#46
yalla Veteran Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: oz Posts: 1,848	psst Notsri You seem to know stuff that may give me an answer to an unanswered question. When was the title "rabbi'' first used in Judaism? I can't find a simple answer anywhere. Basically I just want to know if the term was used pre 70 CE or not? Please respond- simply.

09-28-2005, 12:21 PM	#47
CJD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: greater Orlando area Posts: 832	yalla, the title was apparently first used for those leaders or patriarchs of the Sanhedrin in the first century ce. The Mishnah mentions it too. That's about all I know on this subject. Now, on to my purpose for re-posting: Let it be known that no listener of Jesus on the Mount of Olives as recorded in the Synoptics would have expected to see Jesus literally descending on literal clouds. I don't ever want to see another post here that suggests otherwise. CJD

09-28-2005, 12:49 PM	#48
Dharma Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: U.S. Posts: 1,398	there are two strands of the concept of the "son of man": 1) Jewish one - where the son of man is an ordinary weak human. 2) The Son of Man as super hero does come more from the "indo European", where Manu, the first Man is hero and king -- both the story of Ezekiel riding chariots to heaven and this story's association with Syria (where the Vedic Mitanni ruled and introduced war chariots and chariot warfare to the middle east ) is perhaps the biggest indication of this influence.

09-28-2005, 01:03 PM	#49
spin Contributor Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: nowhere Posts: 15,747	In Jer 41:1 there is a great, rby, of the king called Ishmael. It's sometimes mistranslated, but it's there. I just have to find the willpower to deal with your post, CJD spin

09-29-2005, 10:02 AM	#50
CJD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: greater Orlando area Posts: 832	I understand, really. I tend to blather on and on and … on …

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