Originally Posted by CX

Additionally its fairly well established in modern mental health that religious ecstasy can produce compelling experiences including visions without necessarily indicating mental illness.

Originally Posted by Avatar

Take a look at this link:

http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/9941/index.html

...and then tell me that religious ecsasty doesn't lead (or is not an indicator of) mental illness.

Originally Posted by Toto

That's a great link, but it's about wacky end times prophecies, not religious ecstasy as an indicator of mental illness. Most of those end time prophets are just obsessed with incorrect ideas, not in the throes of ecstacy.

A previous generation of scholars casually assumed that religion was a form of mental illness. This approach has fallen out of favor, as religious people have asserted their civil rights, and tolerance is the word of the day.

Originally Posted by Toto

Paul is not here to defend himself, but you can find different views of women in the letters that are attributed to him. It seems unlikely that he was any more misogynist than the culture he lived in.

In his letters and in the book of Acts, Paul appears to work with women in an egalitarian relationship, and there is one passage in his letters that says, in Christ there is no East or West, no male or female (quoting from memory, so this is not exact).

On the other hand, there are passages in Paul's epistles that call for women to be silent in church and obey their husbands (and for slaves to obey their masters.)

Did the same person write both of these passages? There is enough contradictory material about Paul to make him a hero or a villain in your narrative of early Christianity. He might be a repressed homosexual. He might be the victim of later forgers.

And what does this have to do with mental illness?

Originally Posted by Angyson

The relationship between schizophenia and religiosity has been documented.
I find it an odd connection.

Originally Posted by IamMoose

I dunno if the author of Revelation was schizophrenic or not; I'd be more inclined to think that he was experiencing drug induced visions. None of Revelation makes much sense to me I have to say .

I suspect that a lot of the so-called 'demon possession' in the bible was actually schizophrenia though. Sadly, many churches today refuse to recognise mental illness and refer to it as possession.

Originally Posted by CX

I submit that it would be impossible to say. Apocalyptic literature was a well defined genre and the apocalypse of john fits well within that framework. It could very well be that John was syphillitic amputee with a hump and a nasty peyote habit, but we really can't say from the text.

Originally Posted by CX

The various categories of schizo-affective disorders are all relatively rare. Still mental illness in general or other types of cognitive disabilities like down syndrome and what have you were undoubtedly treated either as demon possession or punishments from god in antiquity. As to your second suggestion I'd be very interested to know what "many churches" do not recognise mental illness. We ought be careful not to paint with too broad a brush and give too much importance to relatively small sects, such as has happened with the snake handlers of West Virginia.

Originally Posted by Clivedurdle

Toto

I am completely in favour of toleration towards people with mental health problems. But there does seem to be relationships between fundamentalism, madness and religious behaviour that ought to be explored, and not avoided because of some false fear of being politically incorrect.

Religion and opium of the people comes to mind. Interesting that nowadays madness is treated with drugs and talking therapies are out of favour.

Cognitive dissonance, continually misinterpreting the world, strange beliefs about miracles and the second coming, speaking in tongues, suicide bombing, looks "mad" to me!

Originally Posted by Clivedurdle

Cognitive dissonance, continually misinterpreting the world, strange beliefs about miracles and the second coming, speaking in tongues, suicide bombing, looks "mad" to me!