Dargo

Even Orthodox Jews ignore the more barbaric rules of the Torah. I'm not sure how they determined that stoning is no longer okay, but all those other tedious rules still apply.

Sheshbazzar

I am pressed for time, so am providing these shortened quotations, feel free to look them up and examine their contexts.

Exodus 6:12 _ ".......of uncircumcised lips?"

Exodus 6:30 _ "......of uncircumcised lips?"

Deut. 10:16 _ ......."Circumcise therefore the foreskin of your heart,...."

Deut. 30:6 _ ........."And YHWH your Elohim will circumcise your heart, and the heart of your seed,......."

Jer. 4:4 _ .............."Circumcise yourselves to YHWH, and take away the foreskins of your heart,......."

Jer. 6:10 _ ".............Behold, their ear is uncircumcised, and they cannot hear:......."

Jer. 9:26 _ ".......for all nations are uncircumcised in the heart."

Eze. 44:9 _ "Thus says YAH-YHWH: No stranger, uncircumcised in the heart, nor uncircumcised in the flesh shall enter into My sanctuary,......"

Acts 7:51 _ "You stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit: as your fathers did, so do you."

Julian

[MOD]
The language is getting a bit heated. Please tone it down and keep your posts to commenting on the other poster's arguments.

Julian
Moderator BC&H
[/MOD]

Sheshbazzar

I do not have time for a long reply and explanation for you at this time.
But truth be told, If you were circumcised with the circumcision that is not made with the hands, but were circumcised with that circumcision written about in the above post, then you would KNOW of a certainty of all of these things, and would need no man to reason with you, or to explain to you why Moshe would not circumcise his children.
You first need to make up your mind as to whether you ARE a believer or not, and if you decide that yes you are, then you need to rend and circumcise the foreskin of your uncircumcised heart, this is wrought within the conscience of the converted, but you cannot be converted except that you believe.
Arguing with me here accomplishes you little, beyond establishing that we have differing views. Over thirty years have passed since the day that I accepted YHWH the Holy One of Israel as being my Elohim, and my redeemer.
If you continue to be so superficial in accepting Him into your heart and into your life, the loss WILL BE your own.
I believe you really need to take the time to actually read again ALL of those Laws in Deuteronomy, and to examine your own heart and conscience regarding whether you really believe that you or others ought to pay lip service to enforcing them "without pity" and "without mercy".
The Law IS good if a man use it lawfully, "converting the soul" but no soul IS converted that does not esteem the qualities of mercy, of compassion, and of love unfeigned as being greater than the sum of ALL of the laws which are written.

Prester John

Thankyou. Trying to understand your position, i find my next queries mirror noahs line. I do not see that you have produced definitive scriptural support for your position. I would expect, as its such an important issue, an unambiguous statement in the holy book.

Anyway i'll let you an noah argue it out and read with interest.