Jehanne

I am 38 years old and am an atheist. I was raised in a Protestant evangelical Church, became an atheist in high school, reverted to Christian fundamentalism in college (this time, the Baptist tradition), came back to atheism a year or so later, reverted to Christianity (this time, Catholicism) in March 2001, and came back to atheism in the fall of 2003. Finally, I found this message board in October 2004 and have been "clean" ever since! And, I have some "startling" conclusions from all this:

1) No one in the Western World, except for a handful of religious fanatics and mentally ill individuals, really believes in God, an afterlife, or supernatural/paranormal agents or events. Rather, what occurs in the West for religion is not belief, but rather, a suspension of disbelief. People go to church like they go to the movies, basically, as a means of social and/or mental fulfillment.

2) People are afraid to die, which is the prime motive behind belief in the West. They cannot cope with loss, so they embrace religion to help them cope. It's kind of an "on demand" belief system.

3) Beyond a doubt, atheism has the strongest arguments (falsification, empiricism, "burden of proof"; basically, the scientific method) going for it, but atheism, for most, is a "group experience." In other words, to be an atheist, one must not be afraid to read atheist ideas, something that most theists are unwilling to do!

4) Atheism is the result of one's intellectual inquiry into nature, science, history, etc. That is why I am an atheist, not because it makes me "feel good" but because atheism likely corresponds to reality.

Your thoughts?

Mageth

Well, I disagree with point 1.

I agree that, for many, "religion is not belief, but rather, a suspension of disbelief".

However, I disagree with the statement that "No one in the Western World, except for a handful of religious fanatics and mentally ill individuals, really believes in God, an afterlife, or supernatural/paranormal agents or events."

I know many people that really believe that I would certainly not classify as "religious fanatics" or "mentally ill."

BigJim

#1 is a pretty strong statement. I get what you're saying in principle, but I disagree. I'm of the opinion that most people do honestly "believe" the myths they've been taught, but they haven't examined them critically. I think there is a line between "suspension of disbelief" and "blind acceptance and lack of critical thinking".

Suspension of disbelief when going to the movies (or reading fiction) is done for entertainment purposes. Faith is tied to hopes of afterlife. It's far more complicated than entertainment, or social fulfillment.



As far as your journey to disbelief, I'm surprised it took 3 tries before it really stuck. After initially rejecting Xianity what made you give it another try (twice)?

Evoken

#1 is a broad and unrealistic generalization.


Valz

Jehanne

Historically speaking, people spend less time and less money on religion these days than they did a century or more ago, even though we have more "free time" than did people who lived in the past. I am not trying to start an argument here (because, this is, as I state in the title, something that we can certainly disagree upon), but why do you think that this is the case? If we could quantify belief as psychologists quantify IQ, is belief increasing, decreasing, or remaining constant over time? I would argue for the "decreasing" option.

Jehanne

The first heretics were burned around 1000 AD, the last around 1800 AD. So, for over 200 years now, no one in the West has been burned for heresy, at least as part of some organized, civil process. Why?

Jehanne

I did not encounter true atheistic arguments until I went "online" in 2003. (We did not even have cable TV before then!) For instance, in high school, I was bombarded with the likes of Josh McDowell, and I never encountered any scholarly opinions regarding his work until I read Richard Carrier's writings over two years ago. Now, McDowell looks like an idiot to me! Christianity certainly has an emotional appeal, which is undeniable, and Christian apologists do make a good argument for their beliefs, until, at least, one hears a contrary, scholarly opinion!

Mageth

All very interesting, but this appears to have little to do with your broad assertion that "No one in the Western World, except for a handful of religious fanatics and mentally ill individuals, really believes in God, an afterlife, or supernatural/paranormal agents or events."

Jehanne

Since Newton, science has become the objective, and religion, the subjective. Now, fundamentalists can only go after gays, having lost the battle for prayer in school, abortion, and now, creationism. Society in the West no longer believes, which is why church attendance has dropped and is why people are no longer willing to impose their beliefs on others, except, of course, for that vocal minority.

funinspace

Not trying to nitpick, but heretics were also killed in the 3rd-5th centuries as well...Gnostics and Donatists come to mind.