aChristian

Belief in Christianity is based on historical facts that cannot be honestly denied. Belief in anything else, including your beliefs, have no foundation - they are only based in blind faith.

aChristian

Interesting question. I would guess, and it is only a guess, that they may have been so astonished that he claimed to have seen Abraham, that they didn't even get to the part about his claim of divinity. Or maybe since they just dismissed his claim of divinity out of hand, they didn't bother with it but just jumped on the extraordinary claim to have seen Abraham.

Toto

Preaching is not welcome in this forum.

Calling people who disagree with you dishonest is not welcome.

aChristian

I was merely countering his claim that Christianity is based on belief alone apart from facts. I was pointing out that in my opinion, the evidence for Christianity from any field of study (history, science, philosopy,etc.) is incontrovertible. As Paul said in Romans 1, the evidence for God's existence and divine power is so strong, that men are without excuse for not believing it. Since it is true and God is loving and wants all men to come to know him, anyone who is honestly seeking the truth will find Christianity to be true. One may be honest and be on his way to finding the truth, but if he doesn't find it, it is his own fault (lack of honesty being part of his sin), not God's. This applies to all of us.

storytime

The implication seems to be there alright. Jesus implying that he was with the Father before, in heaven. But just because Jesus may have believed himself a divine character doesn't mean that he really was such.

steve_bnk

Don't confuse historical evidence of Christianity.I doubt any historians would question an historical JC. Some of the OT locales have been found. Howeve this is not a proof of god.

Listen and think this through.

'Because it is written in an ancient text it is true..', this is the basis of your proof of god.

If you read on all the historical mainstrem religions you'll find eyewitness accounts of saints, prophets, and mircales.

Why believe only the New Testamant?

From a recent discussion with a Muslim and a Christian I work with, a Muslim is one who submits to the will of god, no different than a Christian, although the Chritian did not agree. Aside from aspects of theolgy in my opinion Muslims and Christains are spiritualy fundamentaly the same.

Remember Orson Welle's radio show on War Of The Worlds when millions of peiole though we wre under attack by Martians?

Or the fact that many republicans were convinced through rel;enless inuendo that Obama was a Muslim radical.

Peole easily believe.

Consider the sparse words of JC in the NT, what you have today is the acumulated dogma and personal interpretaions over 2000 years

No Robots

It seems to me that all he was saying something like: "Forget about Abraham, he's dead and gone: I am here and now." Provocative enough, to be sure.

storytime

And..wasn't his purpose to be a martyr? In provoking his peers he got what he wanted, death. To become as the prophets before him, embrased with adulation, in fulfillment of a prophets fate. And unless he died he could not remove sin. "for without the shedding of blood - in appeasement to Yahweh - there is no forgiveness of sin."

Makes no sense to me, but maybe Yahweh required the blood of the firstborn sons of Jacob as human sacrifice.

steve_bnk

Good point, going by the NT he set himself up. and sources from other than the NT indicate Judas may not have been a traitor but a trusted agent of JC in handling the handover to the authorities.

He could have aborted at any time.

No Robots

History is full of examples of gross injustice meted out to the lovers of justice.

[T]he just man who is thought unjust will be scourged, racked, bound—will have his eyes burnt out; and, at last, after suffering every kind of evil, he will be impaled: Then he will understand that he ought to seem only, and not to be, just.—Republic II