Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Toto · 12-23-2012, 04:51 PM

NEW RULE: You may not refer to Jesus as Bilbo Baggins.

If Jesus is fictional, he is a different character from Bilbo Baggins.

sotto voce · 12-23-2012, 04:54 PM

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Originally Posted by mountainman

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Originally Posted by sotto voce

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Originally Posted by mountainman

The law appears in Codex Theodosianus dated to 326 CE.

Find it in the Bible, and you can post here without seeming like a very tedious Jesuit.

The H in BC&H is ancient history.

And 'B' stands for Bible, that people tend to associate with Christianity, even by the buggers who it is here claimed wrote the NT! So unless you can find a reference authorising state privileges for Christians in the Bible, anything else that you or anyone may quote means absolutely diddly squat.

I can find you plenty of Bible quotes that put an unshaved fence-post up the fundamentalist fundament of any and every state 'church'. Hoist on their own petard, you might say.

mountainman · 12-24-2012, 05:43 PM

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Originally Posted by outhouse

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Originally Posted by mountainman

In the time of Diocletian the majesty of the Roman state supported Asclepius, Hercules, Apollo and a few other cults. .

Sorry your wrong.

Asclepius had been supported before that.

It's obvious that Ascepius had been around for centuries by the time of Diocletian, but the point is that Diocletian also sponsored via the majesty of the state a series of figures.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cambridge Ancient History Volume 12 OFFICIAL RELIGION

The following is evidenced by coins and temple foundations:

Claudius: magnified the cult of Cybele.

Gauis: in Rome introduced Osiris (and other Egyptian deities accepted in Italy)

Vespasian: favored Isis and Sarapis.

Domitian: was a benefactor of Isis, Minerva and Jupiter

Hadrian: built the temple of Venus and restored many temples in Rome.

Severan Dynasty: sponsored Bacchus, Hercules and Sarapis.

Illyrian Dynasty: were devoted to Vesta.

Aurelian: built the temple of Sol Invictus, celebrated 25th December and established priestly colleges.

Diocletian: supported Sol Invictus, Isis, Sarapis, Jupiter and Hercules.

Also see Edward Gibbons description of Diocletian's palace.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scribble Scribble Mr Gibbon

Chapter 13: Asclepius in the Palace of Diocletian.

Before we dismiss the consideration of the life and character of Diocletian, we may for a moment direct our view to the place of his retirement. Salona, a principal city of his native province of Dalmatia, was near two hundred Roman miles (according to the measurement of the public highways) from Aquileia and the confines of Italy, and about two hundred and seventy from Sirmium, the usual residence of the emperors whenever they visited the Illyrian frontier. (115) A miserable village still preserves the name of Salona; but so late as the sixteenth century the remains of a theatre, and a confused prospect of broken arches and marble columns, continued to attest its ancient splendour. (116) About six or seven miles from the city Diocletian constructed a magnificent palace, and we may infer, from the greatness of the work, how long he had meditated his design of abdicating the empire.
....[...]...

Though Constantine, from a very obvious prejudice, affects to mention the palace of Diocletian with contempt, (118) yet one of their successors, who could only see it in a neglected and mutilated state, celebrates its magnificence in terms of the highest admiration. (119) It covered an extent of ground consisting of between nine and ten English acres. The form was quadrangular, flanked with sixteen towers. Two of the sides were near six hundred, and the other two near seven hundred, feet in length. The whole was constructed of a beautiful freestone, extracted from the neighbouring quarries of Trau, or Tragutium, and very little inferior to marble itself. Four streets, intersecting each other at right angles, divided the several parts of this great edifice, and the approach to the principal apartment was from a very stately entrance, which is still denominated the Golden Gate.

The approach was terminated by a peristylium of granite columns, on one side of which we discover the square temple of Asclepius, on the other the octagon temple of Jupiter. The latter of those deities Diocletian revered as the patron of his fortunes, the former as the protector of his health.

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Talking about Eusebius, only gives us a snapshot of what the Christian movement was like 300 years after it started.

Talking about Eusebius gives us everything that was ever reported from the far side of the Council of Nicaea about the so-called "Early Christian Movement". He represents our only so-called "historical" source. He had many continuators but no rivals. We have no other so-called "history" of the Christian movement other than Big E's.

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The majesty of the Jesus figure according to church legend evolved and became more profound in the occult, behind the scenes invocations to the gods.

But it was not until the appearance of Bullneck that the Jesus figure duly received the recognition of the majesty of the Roman state

Constantine is the main reason this deity figure recieved recognition.

Thankyou. I agree.

The Historical Jesus figure originally received its majesty from this Emperor.

What does this imply?

mountainman · 12-24-2012, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

NEW RULE: You may not refer to Jesus as Bilbo Baggins.

If Jesus is fictional, he is a different character from Bilbo Baggins.

Happy Saturnalia Toto.

:wave:

mountainman · 01-01-2013, 06:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

NEW RULE: You may not refer to Jesus as Bilbo Baggins.

If Jesus is fictional, he is a different character from Bilbo Baggins.

What is the purpose of this rule?

Is it intended to protect the majesty of Jesus from defamation?

What is an acceptable nom de plume for He who wrote to Agbar?

Are historical variants ok like Bob Jesus Hope (On the Road to Jerusalem)?

And do you agree or disagree (with post #33) that the Historical Jesus figure originally received its majesty from Constantine?
.

Chili · 01-01-2013, 07:18 PM

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Originally Posted by mountainman

And do you agree or disagree (with post #33) that the Historical Jesus figure originally received its majesty from Constantine?
.

Let me remind you again that even the idea of majesty related to Jesus exists only in your mind because Catholics do not have a prayer to him. They only do the Our Father between tons of Hail Mary's. No litany either and we also have lots of those.

Toto · 01-01-2013, 07:24 PM

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Originally Posted by mountainman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

NEW RULE: You may not refer to Jesus as Bilbo Baggins.

If Jesus is fictional, he is a different character from Bilbo Baggins.

What is the purpose of this rule?

It is to maintain some semblance of a discussion here, as opposed to an endless repetition of stale, boring comments.

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Is it intended to protect the majesty of Jesus from defamation?

Nope. Defame away, as long as you say something new or interesting.

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What is an acceptable nom de plume for He who wrote to Agbar?

Are historical variants ok like Bob Jesus Hope (On the Road to Jerusalem)?

No.

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And do you agree or disagree (with post #33) that the Historical Jesus figure originally received its majesty from Constantine?
.

These are meaningless terms to me.

mountainman · 01-01-2013, 08:57 PM

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Originally Posted by Toto

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Originally Posted by mountainman

... the Historical Jesus figure originally received its majesty from Constantine?

These are meaningless terms to me.

Since when? The historical Jesus, imperial state majesty, Roman Emperor Constantine ... which of these terms are meaningless to you?

Chili · 01-01-2013, 10:52 PM

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Originally Posted by mountainman

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Originally Posted by Toto

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Originally Posted by mountainman

... the Historical Jesus figure originally received its majesty from Constantine?

These are meaningless terms to me.

Since when? The historical Jesus, imperial state majesty, Roman Emperor Constantine ... which of these terms are meaningless to you?

You do your work very well Pete, but let me suggest that for you own good you should put it rest before you drown in your own argument.

It so happens that I like what the Emperor did for I see goodness surrounded by beauty with love flowing freely in all directions to achieve what they did.

Of course we are different, and I am certainly am not begging you to see it my way.

Sheshbazzar · 01-02-2013, 06:40 AM

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Originally Posted by Chili

I see goodness surrounded by beauty with love flowing freely in all directions to achieve what they did.

Of course we are different,

The documented progress of this matter makes a much more compelling case for evil disguised as religion surrounded by vanity and royal pomp with blood flowing freely in all directions to achieve what they did.

Of course we are different. Most justice loving people have no admiration or praise for power hungry tyrannical dictators manipulating mobs with bloody hands.

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12-23-2012, 04:51 PM	#31
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	NEW RULE: You may not refer to Jesus as Bilbo Baggins. If Jesus is fictional, he is a different character from Bilbo Baggins.

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