Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Johann_Kaspar · 12-04-2003, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lpetrich
Kilgore Trout:
Jesus wanted to change the laws of the Torah.

Johann_Kaspar:
Where is the evidence?

Rather contradictory. Jesus Christ claimed that he will uphold the law, down to every last detail, while revoking some of it, like:

"An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth"
One must not work on the Sabbath, no matter what
Adultery is to be punished with stoning to death

"Jesus" is a greek name translation. Hebrew speaking people will never call themselves "Jesus".

Except that such "translation" was common back then; consider the Septuagint's "translations" of a lot of Biblical names, some of which we English-speakers continue to use, like "Moses" for "Moshe", "Solomon" for "Shlomo", etc.

Some contradictions could be just different interpretations. One must always remember that Jewish joke: where there are 12 Jews, there are 13 synagogues. Some other contradictions could be later interpolations or layers added to the texts. I am always amazed how some people can think that the different gospels could have been written by one writer at one time...

Do nowadays Hebrew speaking people call themselves Moses or Solomon?

Johann

Johann_Kaspar · 12-04-2003, 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Kilgore Trout
Yes, lpetrich is right. Lots of examples in Matthew 5 right after the sermon on the mount. You are not supposed to change the Law in the slightest way, and Jesus changed lots of laws.

If Jesus didn't revoke the Torah how come christians ignore almost all the rules in the Torah?

The synoptic gospels (let us forget about Yeshua, it is not important) are name calling against Pharisees and Saducees who are accused to not follow the law. All depends of one's goals.

Easy to understand: xians read Greek and not Hebrew anymore and forgot about the very meaning of their name once translated: messianism. Hence all the disappeared texts of "early" messianism (Papias, etc.) when revisionism was at work.

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