Freethought & Rationalism Archive

show_no_mercy · 04-28-2010, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mountainman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

You are completely confused here - the name "Jesus" is identical to the translated name of Joshua, and the LXX preceded the use of nomina sacra. There is no need to drag another of your hobby horses into the discussion.

Hello? Hobby horse? Who is confused? Please --- feel free to correct me if I am mistaken here --- but the name of "Jesus" does not appear in the earliest Greek manuscripts of the New Testament, and even more remarkably does not appear in any of the earliest manuscripts of the Gnostic material. What actually appears (AFAIK) in the earliest manuscripts is only the abbrevated (ie: nomina sacra) form of the (or "some") name.

The oldest manuscripts of the LXX also use a range of nomina sacra, so I am not sure why you would think that the LXX preceded the use of nomina sacra.

With something akin to a poetic licence, the nomina sacra abbreviation has been interpretted by translators to represent the name of Jesus both in the Greek New Testament and in the Coptic material at Nag Hammadi.

The name "Jesus" is not a sacred name in the LXX. There are at least two Jesuses in the LXX: Jesus the successor of Moses, and Jesus the high priest in Zechariah.

mountainman · 04-28-2010, 06:03 PM

Joshua and Jesus - the Marcellus of Ancyra Fragment 4

(nb: link defunct - now perhaps at
www.fourthcentury.com/index.php/marcellus-of-ancyra/)

The Greek word “Jesus” is used in the Old Testament
to translate the (sacred) name Joshua, and in the
New Testament for Jesus of Nazareth.

Marcellus of Ancyra Fragment 4

Fragment number Klost. 1 -- Rettb. 1 -- Vinz. 4
Source Eusebius, Against Marcellus 1.2;
GCS: Eusebius vol. 4 (3rd ed.), pp. 9-10.
Modern edition M. Vinzent, Markell von Ankyra:
Die Fragmente (Leiden, 1997).

Translator's Notes:

The Greek word “Jesus” is used
in the Old Testament
to translate the name Joshua,
and in the New Testament
for Jesus of Nazareth.

Marcellus declares the name Jesus
to be the greatest name upon the earth.
To prove this, he quotes the angel’s
statement to Mary in Luke as well as
a passage in Zechariah.

The Old Testament hero Joshua was given
the same name as the Savior
because he was a type,
i.e. one foreshadowing a future person,
in this case Jesus who leads true believers
into the heavenly Jerusalem.

04-28-2010, 06:03 PM	#12
mountainman Contributor Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Falls Creek, Oz. Posts: 11,192	Joshua and Jesus - the Marcellus of Ancyra Fragment 4 (nb: link defunct - now perhaps at www.fourthcentury.com/index.php/marcellus-of-ancyra/) The Greek word “Jesus” is used in the Old Testament to translate the (sacred) name Joshua, and in the New Testament for Jesus of Nazareth. Marcellus of Ancyra Fragment 4 Fragment number Klost. 1 -- Rettb. 1 -- Vinz. 4 Source Eusebius, Against Marcellus 1.2; GCS: Eusebius vol. 4 (3rd ed.), pp. 9-10. Modern edition M. Vinzent, Markell von Ankyra: Die Fragmente (Leiden, 1997). Translator's Notes: The Greek word “Jesus” is used in the Old Testament to translate the name Joshua, and in the New Testament for Jesus of Nazareth. Marcellus declares the name Jesus to be the greatest name upon the earth. To prove this, he quotes the angel’s statement to Mary in Luke as well as a passage in Zechariah. The Old Testament hero Joshua was given the same name as the Savior because he was a type, i.e. one foreshadowing a future person, in this case Jesus who leads true believers into the heavenly Jerusalem.

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.