stephan huller

But why is that so? Point to the evidence that suggests the group was Greek and not Jewish? Perhaps 'Hebrew' is a better term because the specific 'Jewishness' of the group is never attested to (Philo makes reference to 'Israel,' 'Moses,' 'the prophets' and the like). The group could have been made up of converts to Judaism or a mix of racial Jews and proselytes certainly but the first commandment is nevertheless no other gods. Its hard to get around that. Jewishness is negatively defined - i.e. no outsider gods, no outsider ways. That's strict and impossible to get around.

mountainman

The Romans and Greeks had worshipped paganism for generations and I'm just as sure they viewed themselves as Pagans after being raised and taught, only Paganism.

I have cited hundred of pagan citations to the pagan therapeutae. You are very welcome to cite any Jewish or Hellenistic-Jewish citation to Jewish therapeutae that you can find in the sources outside of "VC".

The evidence Outhouse please.

Clivedurdle

Is there a problem with them being both, or it being a Greek group with Jewish members?

I see no reason why Philo would confuse a huge international group and a small unknown group with the same name. Something has happened here, and there are strong propaganda reasons to state they are a small group out of which xianity developed. The last thing xians could admit was that they were using Greek ideas, they even propagandised the Greeks, labelling them pagans!

It is easy to forget the incredible damage done by xians from the 300's onwards to the true gods, by people like Ambrose.

We should really be worshipping Zeus and Achilles now. We are not.

mountainman

I am only going to answer the last [bolded] question.

Eusebius manipulated his sources to suit his agenda.

What does an arm's length removed mean?

stephan huller

But I think you are confusing the idea of 'greek ideas' with 'greek religion' and idolatry. Jews can adopt philosophical ideas from foreigners as long as they don't contradict the various commandments especially the first commandment (= against idolatry). No one doubts that the community was influenced by Greek philosophical ideas as was Philo, but Philo was not an idolater. He had strictly defined notions which separated him from paganism which he equated with lust and sin.

stephan huller

So once again the Alexandrian community as a whole (= Philo and the therapeutae) likely spoke Greek as their first language, read the Pentateuch and related scriptures in Greek but were nevertheless 'Jewish' (as I said Hebrew is probably the better term but that is the terminology that is used). Jewish meaning here adverse to foreign gods, foreign religion and foreign ways. Plato and many of the Greek philosophers were apparently kosher.

stephan huller

A similar thing has happened in American political life today. In the 'culture wars' of this country Christians are now the allies of conservative Jews against secular culture. The enemy is always lust.

mountainman

It may not have been Philo writing "VC" and being confused.

It may have been a purposeful false sign-post.


Before Nicaea they also publically executed Chief Priests (i.e. Chief pagan therapeutae), destroyed pagan temples and/or prohibited temple services and, following the Council of Antioch , tortured pagan magistrates and philosophers who refused to confess to their agenda.

After Nicaea things got a lot worse for the pagans and the pagan therapeutae,

mountainman

Said the Jewish mouse to the Pagan elephant in the room.

mountainman

Don't forget ignorance.