gstafleu

Jeffrey, I must admit I don't quite get it. First about the brokenness of the bread. The various translations I can access from Perter Kirby's site all talk about broken bread in 9. Now they could of course be wrong. But in the Greek version, it seems that the word translated as "broken" is "klasma-". In my NT Greek dictionary "to klasma" is "a piece" and the word derives from klaw "to break (of bread)." So I'm not quite sure why "broken" is not a correct translation.

As to "bread," 9 doesn't seem to have artos at all, just (3a) peri de tou klasmatov, similar in 4a. The closest artos is in 8 as part of the lord's prayer. So is the Greek just talking here about "the broken," which is seen to refer to bread? Perhaps "the broken," lacking an object noun, usually referred to bread?

Then we have "scattered": touto [to] klasma dieskorpismenon. From the Perseus project I gather that diaskorpizô is "to scatter abroad." My Greek is not good enough to verify it, but the translations indicate that what was scattered is what was broken. Given that Osiris body was torn into many pieces (by Set) and then scattered all over Egypt, we seem to have a link here: tearing into pieces and breaking bread seem rather similar activities.

So what was broken if it wasn't bread, and if it was not broken, what does klasma- mean?

Now as for the connection of the bread to the Eucharist. 9 is about thanks giving, which is eucharist- in Greek, so I'm a bit confused as to why the connection isn't there. "Eucharist-" is also the word for thanks giving used in the gospel scene of "this is my body..." (in Luke; Mark and Matt use ευλογησας with the bread but then eucharist- with the wine). You say the bread in question was what was handed out to the the four and five thousand. I just don't see any reference to that in 9.

Gerard Stafleu

Malachi151

Wow, I don't want to get ahead of myself here, but I just found some very critical parallels dealing with Didache and Wisdom of Jesus son of Sirach.

All of the sayings in Didache that are marked by Christians has relating back to Matthew, in fact more closely relate back to Wisdom of Jesus son of Sirach.

I'm writing up something on this now.

Malachi151

This is based on the references given in the Catholic Encyclopedia:

hatsoff

That's an interesting observation. I can't say I agree with your interpretation, but it definitely is grounds for suspicion. I wonder if there is any other corroboration for your hypothesis outside of the Didache.

S.C.Carlson

According to BDAG, klasma means a "fragment, piece, [or] crumb." It also became a technical term within the Eucharist. That klasma comes from a verb that means "break" is interesting to the etymologist, but fallacious to the exegete because the meaning of a word is determined by its (synchronic) usage, not its (diachronic) history.

The discussion in Niederwimmer's commentary indicates that scholarly opinion understands klasma here as a technical term, and some even suggest that it must be secondary to what the Didache originally said.

Stephen

gstafleu

Thanks for looking that up Stephen. So if klasma is a technical term in the Eucharist, what does it refer to? Still bread, or at least the wafers? But whatever it is, it is connected with the Eucharist and it was scattered over the hills, right?

You mean they see klasma as an interpolation? The Eucharist ritual has wine and bread. 9:2 mentions the wine, 9:3 the bread. Is all of 9:4 an interpolation? Could be I suppose, it has a slightly out-of-place feeling. The surrounding text talks about what individuals are supposed to do, 9:4 all of a sudden asks for unity in the whole church. Without 9:4, 9:5 would neatly take up the flow of the teaching, 9:4 seems to interrupt it.

Gerard Stafleu

S.C.Carlson

The pieces of bread. (My understanding is that the "wafer" itself is a medieval invention.)

Right, but nowhere in the Didache is the fragment identified with Jesus's body, is it?

No, not interpolation. The Didache specialists who argue that it is secondary mean that the original term was artos ("loaf"), not klasma, and that klasma was substituted for artos somewhere in the textual transmission that led to our sole surviving copy. There is some textual evidence for it in that the later liturgies, dependent on the Didache, use artos instead.

Stephen

Amaleq13

Nope, it is the church.

Ben C Smith

What I would really like to see is an hypothesis of the origins of the eucharist and agape feasts that neatly explains every shred of data we have on the subject, from the synoptic last supper accounts to the Johannine last supper account and talk of eating flesh in chapter 6, from the Pauline version to the Didache version, from the freeloaders in 2 Thessalonians to the love feasts in Jude, from the connections with the miraculous feedings to the connections with the miraculous fish-catching(s).

Sample problems to solve: If Jesus originated the eucharist during his lifetime, why does it take so many different forms? If Jesus did not originate it during his lifetime, where did it originate that it is spread out across so many lines of tradition?

Any takers?

Ben.

Malachi151

Well, I think that this is the right track. I think that the eucharist meal is perhaps the single most important aspect of this whole Jesus business.

The eucharist provides us with ceremony around which everything else can develop.

I think that Didache certainly represents a step in the evolution of the Jesus cult.

The eucharist is not only ceremony that serves as the anchor of the cult, but it also provides us with the vehicle for historicity.

Thanksgiving ritual that involves the breaking of bread and drinking of wine for the glory of God.

Thanksgiving ritual that involves the breaking of bread and drinking of wine, attributed to thanks for immortality in God.

Thanksgiving ritual that involves the breaking of bread and drinking of wine, attributed to thanks for immortality in God, revealed through his Servant, Jesus.

Thanksgiving ritual that involves the breaking of bread and drinking of wine, attributed to Jesus Christ, revealed by the Prophets. The bread represents his body, the wine his blood.

Thanksgiving ritual that involves the breaking of bread and drinking of wine, attributed to Jesus Christ, revealed by the Prophets. The bread is his body, the wine his blood, the real blood and real body of the real man.

Thanksgiving ritual that involves the breaking of bread and drinking of wine, attributed to Jesus Christ, which he showed to his disciples. The bread is his body, the wine is his blood, the real blood and real body of the real man.

The eucharist is the vehicle of historization, because as the eucharist comes to symbolize real blood and real flesh, then you have to have had a real person whose real blood and flesh it represents.