Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Colander of Truth · 04-13-2007, 10:35 PM

Would agnostics be the gnat-rapists then?

Condraz23 · 04-13-2007, 10:39 PM

Possibly.

The Path of Needles · 04-13-2007, 10:40 PM

Rape is a crime because it is damaging. There is evidence that it is damaging. Where is the evidence for god?

PostMortem · 04-13-2007, 10:45 PM

Quote:

I am an at-rapist

Someone's been experimenting with mushrooms I see.

Tuvar Ane Ingolenen · 04-13-2007, 11:00 PM

The point seems to be:

If

Theists are not justified in their belief that god(s) is(/are) real, because 'it just feels right', is not good enough.

Then

People who believe rape is a crime are not justified in their belief, because rape 'just feels wrong', is not good enough.

Yes/No?

Waning Moon Conrad · 04-13-2007, 11:12 PM

Xeno, have you ever been raped?

adren@line · 04-13-2007, 11:13 PM

either this is a joke or Xeno has nothing better to do then philosophize on rape.

PostMortem · 04-13-2007, 11:25 PM

OK, I went back to some of Xeno's previous posts to see if I could get a handle on where he is coming from. (I still don't get why this is in Existence of gods) His last post was about a year ago and it was also on the topic of rape:

Rape(!) & The Existence of God
http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.php?t=166798

(To be honest I find that somewhat troubling)

He seems to be making many of the same arguments in that thread as he is here.

I'm just going to take up one part of his argument that I feel is false.

From Xeno's OP for this thread:

Quote:

Children are indoctrinated with the belief at a very early age that forcing someone to have sex with you is extremely wrong and traumatizing. Rape is one of the truly worst crimes, as espoused by the t-rapists, and they demand swift and brutal justice to any trespasser. This system is built into members of society at a very young age, and forcing this belief on people is completely amoral. Believing rape is such a horrible crime has caused hundreds of thousands of rapists to be either killed or imprisoned for inhumane amounts of time. Not only that, but having this irrational belief permeated throughout society - especially to children at such young ages - causes the victims to not only feel the slight discomfort they would normally feel during a rape, but also to believe that they truly are traumatized!

From Xeno's OP to the other thread:

Quote:

It could be argued, to this individual, that if rape were not treated as such a hideous crime, the psychology of the victim would not be so aversely affected, and in the end the same sort of people would still be committing rape, but generally, if it were not a crime at all, the damaging effects on society (a person's trauma and another person's punishment) could be avoided.

I'm going to speak from personal experience. (I realize not always the best way to make an argument, but in this case I can't think of a better example)

I am male, however I have been raped, repeatedly! When I was a child one of my relatives would sodomize me regularly. Your argument, I believe, is that without indoctrination I would not have felt bad about the sodomizing. When it began I was VERY young, too young to know what sex was. In fact when I was young there was very little in the way of public discussion of rape or incest, not like there is today, in schools, in the media. It wasn't even talked about in order to make people feel shame, it just wasn't talked about at all. I had no idea that such a thing existed or should be bad. You, I imagine come from a generation when these things were talked about a lot, but keep in mind that was not always the case. However after the first time I was raped I felt violated!!! At that age I couldn't have put that word to what I was feeling but I knew something was wrong. I was horribly upset.

Now, you may claim that my feeling was still the result of indoctrination, fine believe that if you will. BUT I was STILL physically harmed. Do you suggest that it is NOT a crime to physically hurt/damage someone. Imagine what an adult's penis does to a boys rectum!!! REPEATEDLY!!!! It was painful and it did damage my insides. To this very day (decades later) I still suffer from physical problems as a result of what was done to me. Do you argue that rape is not physically damaging? If so than you haven't a clue!!! Hurting someone physically is clearly a crime. And if you try to make the argument that it is different for women, then you really don't know anything about female anatomy. The vagina is not just an open hole that will accept being entered anywhere at anytime. Any woman that has been raped will tell you it is a physically painful and a physically damaging experience!

You know I feel SICK from having to explain to another human being that rape is physically harmful!!! I need to go outside and get a breath of fresh air!

I hope some others on this board will take the time to rip apart Xeno's arguments!

Condraz23 · 04-13-2007, 11:36 PM

Sorry to hear that PostMortem.

Rape is usually about having power and control over someone else. Rapists are usually anti-social, sadistic men who seek enjoyment in watching little children suffer. The aversion to rape is a natural human characteristic. If rape was legalized, then it would be nessecary to eliminate this natural aversion using genetic or chemical engineering. However, this is impossible to do with modern technology.

RAFH · 04-14-2007, 02:16 AM

AT computers are old hat. Why are you raping old computers? Better yet, why are you raping computers in the first place?
What kind of pervert are you?

Its just a machine, defenseless and innocent. How could you be so thoughtless and inconsiderate. Just a poor little antique machine, unable to even run Vista or process good porn. How can you be so heartless?

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04-13-2007, 10:35 PM	#11
Colander of Truth Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Sri Dunka .... Donut: Cruller w/Jimmies Posts: 2,710	Would agnostics be the gnat-rapists then?

04-13-2007, 10:39 PM	#12
Condraz23 Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: New Zealand Posts: 2,256	Possibly.

04-13-2007, 10:40 PM	#13
The Path of Needles Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: . Posts: 566	Rape is a crime because it is damaging. There is evidence that it is damaging. Where is the evidence for god?

04-13-2007, 11:00 PM	#15
Tuvar Ane Ingolenen Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: 52.35412N 4.90495E Posts: 1,253	The point seems to be: If Theists are not justified in their belief that god(s) is(/are) real, because 'it just feels right', is not good enough. Then People who believe rape is a crime are not justified in their belief, because rape 'just feels wrong', is not good enough. Yes/No?

04-13-2007, 11:12 PM	#16
Waning Moon Conrad Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Victoria. Australia Posts: 1,417	Xeno, have you ever been raped?

04-13-2007, 11:13 PM	#17
adren@line Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: California Posts: 2,615	either this is a joke or Xeno has nothing better to do then philosophize on rape.

04-13-2007, 11:36 PM	#19
Condraz23 Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: New Zealand Posts: 2,256	Sorry to hear that PostMortem. Rape is usually about having power and control over someone else. Rapists are usually anti-social, sadistic men who seek enjoyment in watching little children suffer. The aversion to rape is a natural human characteristic. If rape was legalized, then it would be nessecary to eliminate this natural aversion using genetic or chemical engineering. However, this is impossible to do with modern technology.

04-14-2007, 02:16 AM	#20
RAFH Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Kahaluu, Hawaii Posts: 6,400	AT computers are old hat. Why are you raping old computers? Better yet, why are you raping computers in the first place? What kind of pervert are you? Its just a machine, defenseless and innocent. How could you be so thoughtless and inconsiderate. Just a poor little antique machine, unable to even run Vista or process good porn. How can you be so heartless?

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