FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > Religion (Closed) > Biblical Criticism & History
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Yesterday at 03:12 PM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-24-2012, 09:13 PM   #61
Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: the fringe of the caribbean
Posts: 18,988
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto View Post
I think we should wait until March 20 and see what Ehrman writes before either praising or condemning him. There's a lot going on in the world in the meantime that is more important and entertaining than this issue.
Yes, we should wait until the book is out before we condemn him. :devil1:
I will be waiting with a garbage bag. It is time that HJers realize their Jesus is NOT coming soon.

I do not see any real difference between those who look for the coming of the heavenly Jesus and those who look for Jesus in a book whose author declared publicly that his source for his Jesus is NOT historically reliable.

This is the 21 st century.

It is time the Jesus Myth Fable be recognized as one of the greatest deception of all time and then be dumped.

Ehrman's debate on the Resurrection with William Craig
Quote:
...You have the same problems for all of the sources and all of our Gospels. These are not historically reliable accounts....
People are waiting for this guy's Jesus?????? People are going to pay money????? Jesus Christ!!!!
aa5874 is offline  
Old 01-24-2012, 10:00 PM   #62
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Bli Bli
Posts: 3,135
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Weiss View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post

Abe just explained what he thought the evidence was.



You need to explain why this is not evidence if you want to deal with the content of Abe's post
The miraculous claims of the OT and NT establish those books as fiction on the face of it. It is ludicrous to even consider these books seriously.
We know that Sai Baba existed but we dont have to accept that the miracles attributed to him happened.
judge is offline  
Old 01-24-2012, 11:01 PM   #63
Contributor
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: MT
Posts: 10,656
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Weiss View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post

Abe just explained what he thought the evidence was.



You need to explain why this is not evidence if you want to deal with the content of Abe's post
The miraculous claims of the OT and NT establish those books as fiction on the face of it. It is ludicrous to even consider these books seriously.
Sure, but what about Josephus?
ApostateAbe is offline  
Old 01-25-2012, 12:11 AM   #64
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New York, U.S.A.
Posts: 715
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aa5874 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toto View Post
Now scheduled as a hardback:

Did Jesus Exist? The Historical Argument for Jesus of Nazareth [Hardcover] (or via: amazon.co.uk)

What started out as an e-book for $6 is now a hardback for $26.99.

The ebook is still available here
Is Bart Ehrman an Agnostic?
Y E S.

Chaucer
Chaucer is offline  
Old 01-25-2012, 12:19 AM   #65
Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: the fringe of the caribbean
Posts: 18,988
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post
We know that Sai Baba existed but we dont have to accept that the miracles attributed to him happened.
The existence of Sai Baba requires an Independent Inquiry and the results cannot be transferred to the Quest for the Historical Jesus.

One can be wrong about Sai Baba and be right about Jesus and vice versa or could be both wrong or both right.

In other words, the existence or non-existence of Sai Baba is IRRELEVANT to the Quest for the historical Jesus.

We need evidence for an historical Jesus but you are looking for evidence for Sai Baba.
aa5874 is offline  
Old 01-25-2012, 12:22 AM   #66
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New York, U.S.A.
Posts: 715
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aa5874 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post
We know that Sai Baba existed but we dont have to accept that the miracles attributed to him happened.
The existence of Sai Baba requires an Independent Inquiry and the results cannot be transferred to the Quest for the Historical Jesus.

One can be wrong about Sai Baba and be right about Jesus and vice versa or could be both wrong or both right.

In other words, the existence or non-existence of Sai Baba is IRRELEVANT to the Quest for the historical Jesus.

We need evidence for an historical Jesus but you are looking for evidence for Sai Baba.
I've noticed countless times before that mythers are incapable of grasping any such thing as an analogy.

Chaucer
Chaucer is offline  
Old 01-25-2012, 12:48 AM   #67
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: On the path of knowledge
Posts: 8,889
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post
We know that Sai Baba existed but we dont have to accept that the miracles attributed to him happened.
___yet we don't know that any Historical Jeebus ever existed, thus we don't have to accept that -anything- attributed to him ever happened.
Sheshbazzar is offline  
Old 01-25-2012, 06:58 AM   #68
Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: the fringe of the caribbean
Posts: 18,988
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaucer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by aa5874 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post
We know that Sai Baba existed but we dont have to accept that the miracles attributed to him happened.
The existence of Sai Baba requires an Independent Inquiry and the results cannot be transferred to the Quest for the Historical Jesus.

One can be wrong about Sai Baba and be right about Jesus and vice versa or could be both wrong or both right.

In other words, the existence or non-existence of Sai Baba is IRRELEVANT to the Quest for the historical Jesus.

We need evidence for an historical Jesus but you are looking for evidence for Sai Baba.
I've noticed countless times before that mythers are incapable of grasping any such thing as an analogy.

Chaucer
How dare you come on BC&H and called people "mythers? WHO the hell are you?

You BELIEVE the Ghost stories in the Bible contains the history of your Jesus.

You EXTRACT history from Mythology.

You seem to be a "MYTH historicists"

Now, are you implying that if Sai Baba existed then Robin Hood must have?

Are you implying that once Sai Baba existed that Plutarch's Romulus and Remus MUST be figures of history?

It is rather illogical and without merit to imply that the existence of a character can be ascertained by Analogy.

You seem INCAPABLE of understanding that YOUR Jesus of Nazareth NEEDS history from antiquity, evidence from antiquity, credible sources of antiquity--NOT analogy.


Jesus was purely analogical--NOT historical.

Over 1800 years ago, a Christian writer ADMITTED Jesus was ANALOGICAL to Myths.

First Apology XXI
Quote:
And when we say also that the Word, who is the first-birth of God, was produced without sexual union, and that He, Jesus Christ, our Teacher, was crucified and died, and rose again, and ascended into heaven, we propound nothing different from what you believe regarding those whom you esteem sons of Jupiter....
You don't seem to understand the difference between MYTH and history.

You appear to be a myth-historicist. Myth and history are analogical to you.

Please, go get a history book for your Jesus--NOT the Bible.

People here don't believe the Bible is credible.

How many times must you be told that the Bible is NOT a History book?

You believe Myth Fables of NT Jesus contains history--myth historicist!!!!!
aa5874 is offline  
Old 01-25-2012, 09:41 PM   #69
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 6,010
Default yes but

Quote:
Originally Posted by judge View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Weiss View Post

The miraculous claims of the OT and NT establish those books as fiction on the face of it. It is ludicrous to even consider these books seriously.
We know that Sai Baba existed but we dont have to accept that the miracles attributed to him happened.
Yes, but unless one attributes miracles to your Sai Baba, would one pay any attention to him? He would be insignificant. The miracles are designed to give him an unearned reputation.

We do not have any evidence supporting the factual existence of a biblical Jesus, on the other hand, so there is no reason to accept the mythology around this literary figure. The same applies to all of the biblical characters such as Abraham, Moses, the prophets, the "Virgin" Mary (an oxymoron if there ever were one), Joshua, take your pick. There is no more evidence for an historical Jesus than there is for Clark Kent or Batman. The problem is that most people seem to have difficulty separating fact from fiction, and that is a major failing of educational systems.
Steve Weiss is offline  
Old 01-25-2012, 09:52 PM   #70
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Cape Town, South Africa
Posts: 6,010
Default What about him

Quote:
Originally Posted by ApostateAbe View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Weiss View Post

The miraculous claims of the OT and NT establish those books as fiction on the face of it. It is ludicrous to even consider these books seriously.
Sure, but what about Josephus?
Are you referring to the well-known forgeries of Josephus Flavius? Even if this scant "evidence" were verified or verifiable, would that make the existence of a man/god a reality? What's your point? Jesus the miracle- worker is obvious fiction, and no amount of second-hand testimony as in Josephus would alter that fact in the slightest. The bible is less credible than a Dell or DC comic book. That people believe in it (the bible) indicates their lack of intellectual competence and their capacity for self-delusion.
Steve Weiss is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:14 AM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.