burning flames

We need His love, and we need to be willing recipients of it

God wants us to be partakers of His love.

Love to be experienced has to be willing, it has to be of our will, how else can we experience love, unless we partake of it of our own will.

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this is like the fundamental reasoning of all christianity.

that the choice of heaven or hell is all on us.

that we either partake in his love or dont... and suffer the consequences?

does this make sense?

HelpingHand

No

Greetings

Walter

ksskidude

Ah nope! How can I be asked to choose something via my free will, when knowing that choosing wrong leads to eternal pain. This is not free will.

It is more like The Godfather, "I'll make them an offer they can't refuse."

burning flames

so would it be wise to go with god, or wiser to say "this is a fucked up premise"
and reject it out of principle?

burning flames

why not?

steamer

You can't feel someone elses love, only your own.

Tell him to put it in a nice bean dip. Do you even know what love is? It isn't something thsat can be partaken of. It is an internally generated feeling that no doubt will die at the same time the generator (brain) does.

This is utter nonsense. Love is a feeling and it I don't think you can will yourself to love. People fall in love and the expression is apt because it is something they discover has happened to them.

No the fundemental reasoning of Christianity is that they lack reason so they require unreasoned faith for anyone to believe it.

You know nothing about any actual heaven or hell. Nothing. As far as you or anyone else knows it is as imaginary as Hogwarts.

Dude, partaking in love is nonsensical. Giving your love to a thing you only imagine should only be done in the privacy of your own home. Preferably in the bathroom area of your home where tissues are handy.

Not a freaking bit. Why don't you think about it and tell us whether or not it makes sense and why?

burning flames

I dont know, I can see how it makes sense if god is saying either love me or dont. or "allow me to fix you and take away all sin and grant you eternal life" or don't...

I guess the part that doesnt make sense to me, if I can get it down to one "thing" is that: if he wants to give us all that, why doesnt he just do it?

or should it be our choice? I dont know

steamer

That's a good question.

A good answer is that he doesn't exist and is only imaginary, therefore he cannot give us anything no matter how much we imagine that he wants to.

burning flames

me: Arent you worried that people are gonna go to hell?

christian buddy:
Yes, I am.

me:
And why are we so clueless and helpless, and god only helps us if we "Accept his gift"

if he wants to give eternal life and take away alkl our sins and sinning nature...

why doesnt he just do it?


CB: Well I don't think we're clueless. Helpless might be accurate. God helps us if we want to be helped--indeed I'm inclined to think he does much more for us than that, since grace requires that he help us even when we oppose him. And yet he doesn't force our hand. Ultimately though, the help, the total help we need, is found only in Christ, and is the same thing as the gift, so its pointless to say "why do we need to accept the gift to get the help." Its like saying why do we need water to have water.

me:
He already forced us into existence.....

CB:
Existence is a gift. I'm inclined to think that if someone desired nonexistence, God would grant it to them...I don't know though.

steamer

CB doesn't even know a god exists. He cannot even show that god does anything. He doesn't know that god provides grace. He makes assertions though as if he knows something.

I like gifts, if a gift of eternal salvation exists, then I accept, thanks so much. On the other hand if I have to manufacture belief in gods that appear to me to be nothing more than things men imagine, I'm afraid that that isn't something I'm capable of doing.

Burning, Do you believe gods are something more than things men imagine? What reason do you have to believe that?