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Old 05-13-2001, 09:32 PM   #1
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Post Revelation - Fact or Fiction

This is in response to a sub-discussion in another thread regarding a purely "literal" interpretation of Revelation.

All are welcome to join. As if I need to ask! :-}

Now, please keep in mind that we are talking about Revelation as an actual literal vision from John as to what will happen, so I will start with something simple, and move on as we settle each point: Revelation 20:3

"And cast him into the bottomless pit..."

Is the bottomless pit a literal fact or otherwise? Yes (will require further discussion) or No (allegory) will be fine, and we can take it from there on the next question.

Norm
 
Old 05-13-2001, 11:36 PM   #2
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Ah so you are in fact going to go the KJV route. I noticed that the NIV uses "Abyss" instead which might be rendered without bottom or anything too deep for measurement. It may be possible to squeak in the meaning to mean as a rhetorical exagerration of unimaginable depth... although I am not sure. I do believe it is a 'literal' pit of a kind, not one in this 'world' so to speak, (which I assume is not the requirement made for 'literal'), perhaps some other 'dimension' or the like. Whatever it is, it does bind Satan in an area that makes it impossible for him to get into our world; the 'dimensional' door is shut. This pit could be a kind of unending vaccuum I guess, another frame of existence(universe-like) created simply for a prison.

Good to see you're starting with the 'hard' ones.
 
Old 05-14-2001, 08:42 PM   #3
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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by fromdownunder:
This is in response to a sub-discussion in another thread regarding a purely "literal" interpretation of Revelation.

All are welcome to join. As if I need to ask! :-}

Now, please keep in mind that we are talking about Revelation as an actual literal vision from John as to what will happen, so I will start with something simple, and move on as we settle each point: Revelation 20:3

"And cast him into the bottomless pit..."

Is the bottomless pit a literal fact or otherwise? Yes (will require further discussion) or No (allegory) will be fine, and we can take it from there on the next question.

Norm
</font>
What is an allegory? The "reality behind it" or just the non-reality behind it?

No, allegory instead of a hole in the ground.

Amos
 
Old 05-14-2001, 08:50 PM   #4
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Would gravity be working in this bottomless pit. Without it, the object thrown in will just float. What type of gigantic star etc must be at the "bottom" of the bottomless pit to create a pull that far across the endless pit/universe? And where is the bottom at?

Can a pit be called a pit without a bottom, isn't that more of a tunnel? But tunnels don't have bottoms, they have ends.

Throw Satan into the endless tunnel. That might have worked better, except there is no gravity to keep him in the tunnel. Ok, place a door that can not be opened on the endless tunnel and that should work fine to hold the booger.

Couldn't God create something more simple to hold the dude. God-Handcuffs should work easier.


[This message has been edited by critical thinking made ez (edited May 14, 2001).]
 
Old 05-14-2001, 09:03 PM   #5
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But then why make an endless tunnel, just a room would be fine. It would take up less space too (environmentally kind).

Eureka God-Jail, why didnít God think of that?
 
Old 05-14-2001, 09:06 PM   #6
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Bottomless Pit... What a Drama Queen !
 
Old 05-14-2001, 09:09 PM   #7
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This thread got transferred from EoG yesterday, and could not be accessed for whatever reasson.

At my request, the thread was transferred again, and is now sitting here with seven responses. Now for some reason, this one can be accessed.

I would prefer to continue discussion on the other "version" of this thread, as it has developed somewhat.

Would a Moderator please close this "version", otherwise discussion through trying to bounse it over two different threads will become too confusing.

Sorry Amos, Critical.

Norm
 
Old 05-14-2001, 10:47 PM   #8
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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by critical thinking made ez:
Would gravity be working in this bottomless pit. Without it, the object thrown in will just float. What type of gigantic star etc must be at the "bottom" of the bottomless pit to create a pull that far across the endless pit/universe? And where is the bottom at?

Can a pit be called a pit without a bottom, isn't that more of a tunnel? But tunnels don't have bottoms, they have ends.

Throw Satan into the endless tunnel. That might have worked better, except there is no gravity to keep him in the tunnel. Ok, place a door that can not be opened on the endless tunnel and that should work fine to hold the booger.

Couldn't God create something more simple to hold the dude. God-Handcuffs should work easier.


[This message has been edited by critical thinking made ez (edited May 14, 2001).]
</font>
Satan was already in 'chains' at this point. I don't see any reason why he has to be falling all the time(considering he is going to be let out again after 1000 years) Floating sounds possible; the angelics have never been so subject to gravity as we are anyway.

 
Old 05-14-2001, 10:56 PM   #9
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Would the chains have weight to them, thus being within the laws of gravity? But then for what purpose?

Traditionally chains where placed on people, not to imprison them as much as to weigh them down. Within a prison, chains have little purpose other than punishment due to the weight.
 
Old 05-15-2001, 12:40 AM   #10
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Can I again ask for people NOT to respond on this thread, but use the other one, and could a Moderator please close or delete this thread.

Thanks

Norm
 
 

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