Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Morat · 05-31-2002, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Anything set up on the moon will not be self-sustaining as the moon lacks the necessary resources.

Which resources do you consider "necessary"?

jfbiii · 06-01-2002, 09:04 AM

Fresh water, the ability to grow food in the necessary quantity and with enough variety to provide a healthy diet including meat.

I would include an ability to replace the human population of the colony as a requirement for "self-sustaining." Thus, any self-sustaining colony would provide the oportunity and means by which to raise a family. A colony consisting only of workers doesn't cut it.

Abacus · 06-01-2002, 04:12 PM

Is anybody here familiar with the work of Gerald O'Neill? He's a big proponent of space colonization, such as on the moon and in rotating wheel space cities. My public library had several of his books on the shelves when I was a kid, which I checked out a lot. Looking back, I realize it was probably a lot of pie-in-the-sky kind of stuff, but it really stimulated my imagination when I was about 12 years old. Anyways, this thread reminded me of him.

[ June 01, 2002: Message edited by: Random Number Generator ]

Answerer · 06-01-2002, 10:27 PM

Come on guys, why keep talking about Moon especially when there is water being discover in Mars already.

beausoleil · 06-01-2002, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by jfbiii:
Fresh water, the ability to grow food in the necessary quantity and with enough variety to provide a healthy diet including meat.

Ultimately you need water and energy. Water was identified at the lunar south pole a few years back and there's no shortage of solar energy.

Liquidrage · 06-02-2002, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Answerer:
Come on guys, why keep talking about Moon especially when there is water being discover in Mars already.

I'll ignore the fact that water has been discovered on the Moon as well.

Water on Mars does us no good.
Outside of sceince fiction created by NASA, we have no means of using the water on Mars at the present.

Our space program is not ready for Mars.

Really, despite my earlier statements in this topis, our space program isn't truely ready for a return to the Moon either.
However, the Moon is plausible in the present, Mars is not.

I would be perfectly happy for NASA to send much time, effort and funding to improve LEO and NEO capabilities.
Such projects would result in a cheaper and more efficient process in which materials from Earth can be put into LEO and NEO. Also an expected outcome would be a station in LEO and NEO that is beneficial to further exploration of space.

As I've mentioned, the ISS is not such a project. It neither improves upon our capabilites to get to NEO and LEO, nor does it provide a means by which future exploration can based from it. It is a very expensive (way over budget) research vessel.

AdamWho · 06-02-2002, 08:00 AM

The ISS is in LEO (low earth orbit). I don't know what NEO is, (near earth orbit?), not a term we use.

[ June 02, 2002: Message edited by: AdamWho ]

Liquidrage · 06-03-2002, 01:58 PM

I never said the ISS isn't in LEO.

NEO is "near earth orbit" and is commonly used as a more generic term to encompass a much wider range then LEO (commonly LEO and MEO). Though as I said it's rather generic in it's use.

fando · 06-06-2002, 10:36 PM

Hmm, I seem to recall that there's a thriving space race among amateur rocket scientists in the US. In particular, I've been following John Carmack's efforts in building a cheap launch vehicle.

I predict that the future space race will be a corporate thing born of the present ambitious ventures.

06-01-2002, 04:12 PM	#33
Abacus Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: South Dakota Posts: 2,214	Is anybody here familiar with the work of Gerald O'Neill? He's a big proponent of space colonization, such as on the moon and in rotating wheel space cities. My public library had several of his books on the shelves when I was a kid, which I checked out a lot. Looking back, I realize it was probably a lot of pie-in-the-sky kind of stuff, but it really stimulated my imagination when I was about 12 years old. Anyways, this thread reminded me of him. [ June 01, 2002: Message edited by: Random Number Generator ]</p>

06-02-2002, 08:00 AM	#37
AdamWho Contributor Join Date: May 2001 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 13,389	The ISS is in LEO (low earth orbit). I don't know what NEO is, (near earth orbit?), not a term we use. [ June 02, 2002: Message edited by: AdamWho ]</p>

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06-01-2002, 09:04 AM	#32
jfbiii Junior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: New Orleans Posts: 7	Fresh water, the ability to grow food in the necessary quantity and with enough variety to provide a healthy diet including meat. I would include an ability to replace the human population of the colony as a requirement for "self-sustaining." Thus, any self-sustaining colony would provide the oportunity and means by which to raise a family. A colony consisting only of workers doesn't cut it.

06-01-2002, 10:27 PM	#34
Answerer Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Singapore Posts: 3,956	Come on guys, why keep talking about Moon especially when there is water being discover in Mars already.

06-03-2002, 01:58 PM	#38
Liquidrage Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Tallahassee Posts: 1,301	I never said the ISS isn't in LEO. NEO is "near earth orbit" and is commonly used as a more generic term to encompass a much wider range then LEO (commonly LEO and MEO). Though as I said it's rather generic in it's use.

06-06-2002, 10:36 PM	#39
fando Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Los Angeles Area Posts: 1,372	Hmm, I seem to recall that there's a thriving space race among amateur rocket scientists in the US. In particular, I've been following John Carmack's efforts in building a cheap launch vehicle. I predict that the future space race will be a corporate thing born of the present ambitious ventures.

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