Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Darth Dane · 05-19-2003, 04:49 AM

<sheep>God is still good and working according to His Plan (tm)</sheep>

Yes, If God Is, then God must be working according to God's desire.

If God is not, then everything is happening as "planned" by the laws of interaction "created" with the big bang.

Take your pick, either is good

Choose, use your freewill to believe as you wish.

DD - Love Spliff

Ronin · 05-19-2003, 04:55 AM

Quote:

Take your pick, either is good

Perpetual, interdependent causes and effects are neither good nor bad...nor influenced by my choice ~

Darth Dane · 05-19-2003, 05:11 AM

Perpetual, interdependent causes and effects are neither good nor bad...nor influenced by my choice ~

Your every move, and activation of any atom in your being affects the rest of the universe. The law of gravity states this is true, for every atom has mass and so by movement affects rest of the universe.

So your choice, does influence the perpetual and interdependant causes, because you have freewill. You can go against yourself and commit suicide, then we can talk about you not affecting anything at all, as you don't exist anymore. But those who are alive will affect all that is alive or exist or Is.

DD - Love Spliff

Ronin · 05-19-2003, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Your every move, and activation of any atom in your being affects the rest of the universe. The law of gravity states this is true, for every atom has mass and so by movement affects rest of the universe.

So true.

Quote:

So your choice, does influence the perpetual and interdependant causes, because you have freewill.
You can go against yourself and commit suicide, then we can talk about you not affecting anything at all, as you don't exist anymore. But those who are alive will affect all that is alive or exist or Is.

Being alive is not the same as existing.

There is nothing in existence that can ever unexist...whether or not it chooses to try.

So much for Gods.

Don't squat with your spurs on.

Darth Dane · 05-19-2003, 05:41 AM

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Your every move, and activation of any atom in your being affects the rest of the universe. The law of gravity states this is true, for every atom has mass and so by movement affects rest of the universe.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So true.

Glad we agree

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So your choice, does influence the perpetual and interdependant causes, because you have freewill.
You can go against yourself and commit suicide, then we can talk about you not affecting anything at all, as you don't exist anymore. But those who are alive will affect all that is alive or exist or Is.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Being alive is not the same as existing.

There is nothing in existence that can ever unexist...whether or not it chooses to try.

So my existance will never unexist, whether or not I am alive---> I am eternal.

Do I exist whether or not I am alive?

You seem to be saying so!

DD - Love Spliff

Ronin · 05-19-2003, 05:46 AM

Quote:

You seem to be saying so!

You have learned much, young padawan.

Now go forth and exist.

Darth Dane · 05-19-2003, 05:50 AM

Ronin: In your opinion are we eternal?

Do we need to fear death?
What do we need to fear anymore, when we have infinity to exist in?

Only Love remains, Love of Life and existance.

DD - Love Spliff

Soul Invictus · 05-19-2003, 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Darth Dane
[B I don't know, I am not sure, God works in mysterious ways.
DD - Love Spliff [/B]

Spliff,

Please do not take it the wrong way, it's just that this answer and those like it are how many theists have no reason to discuss spiritual matters in such a dogmatic fashion or condescending aire. I've gotten this response many a time to my unliking, and can't help but see it as a cop-out clause when one isn't able to align rationality or reality within the scope of one's hardlined belief system.

Darth Dane · 05-19-2003, 06:59 AM

Please do not take it the wrong way,

How can I?

I'm being cheeky here.

... it's just that this answer and those like it are how many theists have no reason to discuss spiritual matters in such a dogmatic fashion or condescending aire. I've gotten this response many a time to my unliking, and can't help but see it as a cop-out clause when one isn't able to align rationality or reality within the scope of one's hardlined belief system.

I see what you mean, because no answer is really forth coming.

But I compare it to nature; why does nature produce tornado's?

an answer could be, it is because clouds clash together and because of some friction appear. True this is teh mechanics. But when will it happen teh next time, why does teh phenomenon exist at all? Well nature moves in mysterious ways.

I don't know all there is to know, so everything I don't know, moves in mysterious ways.

So when we see teh big picture, nothing moves in mysterious ways, because we know the big picture. When we know, it can't be mysterious.

DD - Love Spliff

Magus55 · 05-19-2003, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lpetrich
Pure horse manure.

An omnipotent being would have no trouble getting us to behave in whatever manner It sees fit -- and would be responsible for everything that happens, by commission or by omission, as the case may be.

Yes, by omission. Imagine that as you are driving, you hit some little child. And when you are hauled on court, you offer these defenses:

"I did not turn, and I did not change speed, therefore I had not done anything and thus I am not at fault."

"That little kid was not supposed to be in the road, therefore if anyone has the responsibility, it is that tyke."

And imagine yourself offering these defenses with an absolutely straight face.

Do you think that you will walk?

Also, a completely benevolent being would create Heaven and be done with it, and not act as if It was nearly impotent.

Sigh, i wonder if atheists on this board will ever get a clue and understand theology. Me thinks your only purpose here is to make fun of something you don't even believe in. How about do something constructive and help a world that will disappear for you in a few decades, and stop making yourself look foolish by trying to act like you are better than God? God is sovereign over you, not the other way around - He is in charge not you. You follow him or you face the consequences.

The more and more i read this board, the more i realize how much we humans truly deserve Hell. You treat God like crap, assuming He exists, and expect Him to let you into HIS home, and bask in his wonders and love for all eternity - when all you do is hate him? Get over yourself already.

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05-19-2003, 04:49 AM	#11
Darth Dane Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Required Posts: 2,349	<sheep>God is still good and working according to His Plan (tm)</sheep> Yes, If God Is, then God must be working according to God's desire. If God is not, then everything is happening as "planned" by the laws of interaction "created" with the big bang. Take your pick, either is good Choose, use your freewill to believe as you wish. DD - Love Spliff

05-19-2003, 05:11 AM	#13
Darth Dane Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Required Posts: 2,349	Perpetual, interdependent causes and effects are neither good nor bad...nor influenced by my choice ~ Your every move, and activation of any atom in your being affects the rest of the universe. The law of gravity states this is true, for every atom has mass and so by movement affects rest of the universe. So your choice, does influence the perpetual and interdependant causes, because you have freewill. You can go against yourself and commit suicide, then we can talk about you not affecting anything at all, as you don't exist anymore. But those who are alive will affect all that is alive or exist or Is. DD - Love Spliff

05-19-2003, 05:41 AM	#15
Darth Dane Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Required Posts: 2,349	quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Your every move, and activation of any atom in your being affects the rest of the universe. The law of gravity states this is true, for every atom has mass and so by movement affects rest of the universe. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So true. Glad we agree quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- So your choice, does influence the perpetual and interdependant causes, because you have freewill. You can go against yourself and commit suicide, then we can talk about you not affecting anything at all, as you don't exist anymore. But those who are alive will affect all that is alive or exist or Is. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Being alive is not the same as existing. There is nothing in existence that can ever unexist...whether or not it chooses to try. So my existance will never unexist, whether or not I am alive---> I am eternal. Do I exist whether or not I am alive? You seem to be saying so! DD - Love Spliff

05-19-2003, 05:50 AM	#17
Darth Dane Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Required Posts: 2,349	Ronin: In your opinion are we eternal? Do we need to fear death? What do we need to fear anymore, when we have infinity to exist in? Only Love remains, Love of Life and existance. DD - Love Spliff

05-19-2003, 06:59 AM	#19
Darth Dane Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Required Posts: 2,349	Please do not take it the wrong way, How can I? I'm being cheeky here. ... it's just that this answer and those like it are how many theists have no reason to discuss spiritual matters in such a dogmatic fashion or condescending aire. I've gotten this response many a time to my unliking, and can't help but see it as a cop-out clause when one isn't able to align rationality or reality within the scope of one's hardlined belief system. I see what you mean, because no answer is really forth coming. But I compare it to nature; why does nature produce tornado's? an answer could be, it is because clouds clash together and because of some friction appear. True this is teh mechanics. But when will it happen teh next time, why does teh phenomenon exist at all? Well nature moves in mysterious ways. I don't know all there is to know, so everything I don't know, moves in mysterious ways. So when we see teh big picture, nothing moves in mysterious ways, because we know the big picture. When we know, it can't be mysterious. DD - Love Spliff

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