Freethought & Rationalism Archive

mark24 · 01-10-2003, 08:03 AM

All,

Anyone notice the markers deliberate error?

Student: "The structure of the visceral organs show that apes more alike to man than any other primate� (Clark 2)."

The marker criticizes with �huh? Apes = primates�. Not true, the students point is correct.

Small nitpicky point, but hey?

Mark

KnightWhoSaysNi · 01-10-2003, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Origian
What on earth are you teaching your students over there in the US? Is this a common ocurrence??? Over here in New Zealand I don't think I've EVER met a single person who could write something like this (with the theistic slant I mean) - probably due to the fact that the vast majority of us are Godless though

Not so, my Kiwi friend.

When I was traveling in New Zealand, I encountered a street preacher/creationist in the main square of Christchurch. He was discussing Kent Hovind's bogus $250,000 challenge to present evidence for evolution.

As for 'godly' Kiwis in the forum, perhaps you might be familiar with Tercel?

RufusAtticus · 01-10-2003, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mark24
All,

Anyone notice the markers deliberate error?

Student: "The structure of the visceral organs show that apes more alike to man than any other primate� (Clark 2)."

The marker criticizes with �huh? Apes = primates�. Not true, the students point is correct.

Small nitpicky point, but hey?

Mark

No the teacher/ta is right and being pedantic. "Ape" is an old english word synomous with "monkey/primate." "Great Apes" + gibbons refer to what we think of as "apes." Of course, the sudent isn't wrong either.

From m-w.com

Quote:

ape
Pronunciation: 'Ap
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old English apa; akin to Old High German affo ape
Date: before 12th century
1 a : MONKEY; especially : one of the larger tailless or short-tailed Old World forms b : any of two families (Pongidae and Hylobatidae) of large tailless semierect primates (as the chimpanzee, gorilla, orangutan, or gibbon) -- called also anthropoid, anthropoid ape

great ape
Function: noun
Date: 1949
: any of a family (Pongidae) of primates including the gorilla, orangutan, and chimpanzees -- called also pongid

Ergaster · 01-10-2003, 02:00 PM

Great stuff. I love the ta's comment about Lamarck knowing about genes. LOL!

However: both ta and student messed up with the "family Hominoidae", whatever *that* is....

And they both fail the Wilfred Le Gros Clark test. The man's last name is Le Gros Clark, not "Clark".

Just being pedantic for the first time on the new board.

Quote:

Originally posted by RufusAtticus
No the teacher/ta is right and being pedantic. "Ape" is an old english word synomous with "monkey/primate." "Great Apes" + gibbons refer to what we think of as "apes." Of course, the sudent isn't wrong either.

From m-w.com

beausoleil · 01-10-2003, 02:47 PM

Sad to say, I didn't think it was that badly written compared to the freshman equivalent essays I mark.

However, I've never had one so far from the mark scientifically.

I'm uncomfortable about the marking style, however. If I had a TA peppering essays with sarcastic 'wow' and 'huh's I'd take him aside quietly and advise him or her to take a different approach. Errors of fact and logic need to be corrected, of course, but it's not some pub conversation. Teaching this student in the future is likely to be harder rather than easier, I'd say.

cfgauss · 01-10-2003, 06:31 PM

I don't think a TA corrected it. The style doesn't seem consistent with it, IMO.

beyelzu · 01-10-2003, 08:15 PM

when i took an intro to anthropology class, an auditorium class with maybe 300 students. on the second day of class a girl actually raised her hand at the end and said that she wasnt sure what evolution was. she asked "is that where man came from apes?"

i felt sad for her. i also wondered how she managed to get into uga. you do need about 1100 on the sat after all.

Origian · 01-10-2003, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Not so, my Kiwi friend. When I was traveling in New Zealand, I encountered a street preacher/creationist in the main square of Christchurch. He was discussing Kent Hovind's bogus $250,000 challenge to present evidence for evolution.

OK, so maybe I was exagerating... but still, in the 2001 cencus 26% of us were explicitly godless, with quite a few more not stating religion.

RufusAtticus · 01-10-2003, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Beyelzu
when i took an intro to anthropology class, an auditorium class with maybe 300 students. on the second day of class a girl actually raised her hand at the end and said that she wasnt sure what evolution was. she asked "is that where man came from apes?"

i felt sad for her. i also wondered how she managed to get into uga. you do need about 1100 on the sat after all.

Well the Georgia state biology requirements are crap. I doubt she even got fifty minutes of biology education in high school covering evolution. The teacher probably even prefaced it with a disclaimer saying that she was only teaching it because she had too, i.e. you can put your head on your desk right now if you want too.

That is what my wife went through in high school. (She never took AP Bio, which would have (hopefully) explained things to her.) Until she took Intro the Anthropology at UGA, she thought that evolution conflicted with her faith. After the prof actually explained what it was to the class, she thought "what is the big fucking deal? Why do people have against this?"

Novowels · 01-10-2003, 09:54 PM

Keep an eye on that kid.

We'll be seeing him on the Contributors list at the ICR and/or AIG pretty soon. Probably have a story about how "the man" pushed him down for his "excellent" refutation of evolution in college.

01-10-2003, 09:54 PM	#20
Novowels Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Sydney Posts: 1,658	Re: Best Evolution Paper Ever Keep an eye on that kid. We'll be seeing him on the Contributors list at the ICR and/or AIG pretty soon. Probably have a story about how "the man" pushed him down for his "excellent" refutation of evolution in college.

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01-10-2003, 08:03 AM	#11
mark24 Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: UK Posts: 26	All, Anyone notice the markers deliberate error? Student: "The structure of the visceral organs show that apes more alike to man than any other primate� (Clark 2)." The marker criticizes with �huh? Apes = primates�. Not true, the students point is correct. Small nitpicky point, but hey? Mark

01-10-2003, 02:47 PM	#15
beausoleil Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: US and UK Posts: 846	Sad to say, I didn't think it was that badly written compared to the freshman equivalent essays I mark. However, I've never had one so far from the mark scientifically. I'm uncomfortable about the marking style, however. If I had a TA peppering essays with sarcastic 'wow' and 'huh's I'd take him aside quietly and advise him or her to take a different approach. Errors of fact and logic need to be corrected, of course, but it's not some pub conversation. Teaching this student in the future is likely to be harder rather than easier, I'd say.

01-10-2003, 06:31 PM	#16
cfgauss Regular Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: USA Posts: 108	I don't think a TA corrected it. The style doesn't seem consistent with it, IMO.

01-10-2003, 08:15 PM	#17
beyelzu Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: the peach state ga I am a metaphysical naturalist Posts: 2,869	when i took an intro to anthropology class, an auditorium class with maybe 300 students. on the second day of class a girl actually raised her hand at the end and said that she wasnt sure what evolution was. she asked "is that where man came from apes?" i felt sad for her. i also wondered how she managed to get into uga. you do need about 1100 on the sat after all.

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