atheistdave

You guy's have to read this one before the link is changed.

Hovind Vs. Professor George Bakken at Indiana State University.

<a href="http://www.tribstar.com/display/inn_news/news01.txt" target="_blank">http://www.tribstar.com/display/inn_news/news01.txt</a>

Happy reading,
Dave

I ate Pascal's Wafer

<img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

When I post at this board, and in my normal daily interactions, I'm used to normal, rational people. These nuts are merely abstract conceptions. I know they're out there, but I don't have to worry about reading what they say. I can be blissful in ignoring their presense.

Then you come along and post this link, which reminds me that people like that are still out there and that they actually make up a majority somewhere. Grr...

Don't the people who go to these debates even make an attempt to understand what the other debater is trying to say?

-Nick <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Jimmy Higgins

Mr. Kent Hovind

If evolution is a religion, what does that make Christianity? Lunacy?

The Lone Ranger

I'm amazed he can actually say that with a straight face.

Philosoft

Select wisdom:

Silly woman. God had nothing to do with Tennesee. Told me so himself.

Correctly? I presume this is something other than front-to-back and left-to-right?

"...that woman should have just packed up and left. I mean, it's Dr. Hovind's house! Um, no it's not, I mean it's the Lord's house!"

The Lone Ranger

I have mixed feelings on the wisdom of debating creationists. On the one hand, we absolutely must oppose their attempts to take over the schools, but on the other, public "debates" play right into the creationists' hands by making it look as if their beliefs are as subject to legitimate debate as are those of "Evolutionists."

I've actually had good success in classes, when the subject of creationism comes up. Generally, I make a point of reminding them of how science is done, and pointing out that whatever else might be true, creationism is not science.

I once had some students request that I present the evidence in favor of "Creation Science," as a matter of "fairness." In response, I randomly assigned half the students in the class to research the evidence in favor of evolution, and half to research the evidence in favor of Creationism. The thing was, I specified that each side was allowed to cite only papers that had been published in recognized, peer-reviewed science journals. I also reminded them that pointing out alleged flaws in the "opposing theory" was not a legitimate tactic -- only actual evidence for your "theory" was admissable.

At the end of the semester, the ones assigned to investigate the "scientific evidence" for "Creation Science" were forced to admit that they could find none at all.

***

In "debates" between Creationists and "Evilutionists," the venue is almost always chosen so as to be Creationist-friendly. Universities and science museums don't sponsor these things, for the most part -- churches do.

The "Evilutionist" is all but guaranteed to have a hostile audience. Furthermore, under these circumstances, only a vanishingly small percentage of the audience is going to pay as much attention to the actual quality of the arguments as to the style of presentation. The "professional" Creationists like Hamm are quite experienced at giving presentations that are very entertaining, even if utterly devoid of facts and logic.

The one time I was suckered into a formal debate with a Creationist (they flat-out lied to me in order to get me there), I laid out a very careful and logical presentation. I provided lots of documentation, and was extremely polite and respectful.

My opponent's response was to make a few jokes about some people being "too educated for their own good," and to basically say that I was either an idiot or a liar. The audience gave him an enthusiastic round of applause and clearly considered the matter to have been settled once and for all.

*Sigh*

Michael

[ September 24, 2002: Message edited by: The Lone Ranger ]</p>