pariah

If there is no God, where do societies moral standards come from? Is it because humans are social animals and we thrive in a society, but in order for that society to thrive rules must be set? Do all ethics stem from the "golden rule"? If not, then where?

Although we behave ethically for society, perhaps we only want society to prosper for ourselves..

Thoughts? What are atheists sources of ethics?

dangin

Do wolf packs and gorilla troops have "the golden rule"?

No they don't, yet they are social, and have an order as well as an authority, and consequences for breaking the "rules".

So, since humans were once the same mental and social level as these and every other social animal. It seems clear that being "social" naturally creates the rules that work for that society.


Social evolution, it's not just for eggheads anymore.

pariah

you think ethics exist in society through trial and error?

99Percent

Reason.

Alonzo Fyfe

Go to the forum "Secular Lifestyle and Support" and go to the thread

Ethics Without God: A Personal Journey

As the title suggests, there you will find at least the start to my answer of how one can have an ethics without God.

You may also be interested in particular with Part I and Part V. Within these sections are arguments suggesting that one cannot find ethics in religious text such as the Bible.

The argument contained within these two sections argues that nobody, even the most religious, obtains his or her moral instruction from religoius text. Everybody appeals to an ethics outside of the Bible, and use it in part to determine which parts of the Bible to accept and which to reject as being in error. Indeed, the most horrendous injustices of the past two thousand years -- the inquisitions, the witch burnings, the crusades, the jihads -- have happened when people have accepted biblical ethics carte blanche.

meritocrat

It's really a nonsense to state that religion is the basis of morality. Yes, virtually all religions offer a moral code, nonetheless you can be ethical without being religious.

meritocrat

Atheists base their ethics on common sense and reason (as another person here said).

Why shouldn't an atheist kill? Because it's wrong to do physical harm. Why shouldn't an atheist steal? Well who is the atheist to deprive others of property?

Sarpedon

While I was talking to myself this morning, I said: Religion doesn't have anything to do with morality. Each religion endorses the prevailing moral system of its time: Examples

Judaism. Quite old. Racism: We are GOD's Chosen People! Authority always right "if your son is disobedient, let the elders stone him outside the town gate." etc.

Christianity. Less rascist, still endorses slavery, introduces the concept of passive resistance "render unto caesar those things that are caesars and render unto god those things that are gods" etc.

Modern religions, such as scientology, endorse a much more modern idea of ethics.

All religious people ignore whatever religious rules that go counter to society's ethics. (you don't see jews stoning children, after all (or maybe they just can't find the city gate in modern suburban developments ) And openly trumpet whatever rules happen to coincide with modern ethics. "it is wrong to kill, and BEHOLD! GOD says "thou shalt not kill! Glory to GOD!"

It is clear that the two things are independant of each other.