Family Man

Ah, yes, more whining from our resident cynic. Well, since Radoth is a major source of entertainment on this board, I think this bit of nonsense is worth deconstructing.

Actually, the position is very consistent -- there is no God to fear. I don't think you'll find too many skeptics you'll disagree with that.

Yet another Radothian strawman. Please, Radoth, where has a skeptic said that God ought to fix all of our problems. The position is that a benevolent god could have and would have done a much better job of designing us and our world. Since that doesn't match reality, we wonder if that god actually exists.

Are you saying that you as a Christian do not take responsibility for your actions? That would explain a lot.

Let's see: the worldwhile flood, the destruction of Sodom and Gomarrah, sending bears to kill impertinent children, encouraging genocide -- sounds pretty fearful and abusive to me. Oh, but I forgot: he sent Jesus to change all that. Talk about your inconsistencies: an all-wise god that can't seem to get it right with his children.

Meaning we don't take the question seriously -- duh.

Which only makes us wonder why he didn't just do it right the first time.

So we have God as Avis -- he tries harder, just isn't very good at it apparently.

So exactly how is he limited?

Yeah, those stupid ingrates. Ever consider that this inability for the Israelites to see the obvious was due to this being a piece of fiction?

The typical skeptical response is that your story makes no sense so it is quite reasonable to conclude that there is no God.

While in the real world, it is the beginning of foolishness.

Even if God exists, I don't know if fear is what he really wants -- that seems to me to be what the church wants. I do know that if I saw the Red Sea parted before me by the prophet of god, I wouldn't turn around later and worship a golden calf. The inconsistency you whine about is in your Bible, not in the skeptical position.

No.

You think God -- assuming he exists -- needs me to tell him how to do this?

So he is inconsistent. Nice to know that.

No you haven't. All you have done is what you usually do -- cynically twist what skeptics have to say so that you can make another one of your smug, ignorant posts.

Jayjay

Family Man, that was an excellent post. Only thing I disagree with you is Radorth's entertainment value.

Well, knowing that God exists would be a precondition to fear. Vampires and werewolves would be pretty scary too if it wasn't for the fact that they don't exist. Another component of fear is uncertainty, but in that regard the God of the bible certainly qualifies: you never know if He's going to resurrect the dead or flood the Earth, or whatever else pops in His mind.

So yeah, if I saw some serious evidence that convinced me that the biblical God is real, I'd be afraid. My basic character wouldn't change, but I would be damn sure to do what he says. I'd probably become a celibate monk or a priest, so that I'd have an excuse not to bring children to this world .

I don't think fear of anything is a positive emotion.

Who says God should even have a church? But if he insists on one, why would he reserve the miracles and other tricks to the early church, why not just keep doing it so that every generation can see for themselves which one is the real church? It's this silly indecisiveness that doesn't make any sense if christianity were true... on the other hand, God wants everyone to convert to christianity and repent, on the other hand he doesn't want to show himself because it would somehow rob our "free will". The christian answer to contradictions like this is "oh yeah? Don't judge God!"...



Which one is better, having laws written down so that everyone can see for themselves how they should behave to avoid jail, or there being multiple contradicting lawbooks so that nobody knows which ones are the real laws until the secret police knocks on their door?

Why would the sovereign creator of the universe want so desperately to be respected, loved or least of all obeyed? That's the first hint that the anthropomorphic christian God is just a story made up by humans.

atheist_in_foxhole

I'd ask him why he allows so many MILLIONS of natural, spontaneous abortions to take place if abortion is "wrong." I'd also ask if he would oppose abortion even in cases of rape, incest, or when the woman's life/health is at risk. Unless he came up with some answers I would continue to be pro-choice REGARDLESS of how many booming voices came out of the clouds.

I would ask him why he made ME a homosexual if it was a "sin." I certainly didn't choose to like other men, and at times I've been near suicide because of it, especially when I was a lot younger. And why is there no mention of female homosexuality in the bibble? Is that okay? And why did this "god" create animals that engage in homosexual/bisexual behavior? Are they sinners too? Will they go to hell?

Unless I saw some convincing evidence I would have to conclude that Jesus was just a myth. There are literally dozens of stories about "god men" who were supposedly born to virgins and crucified at that point in human history, and some of these myths were around long before Jesus. So no, I would definitely NOT believe that Jesus was your god's "son."

Believe me, Radorth, reality is a lot nicer than the delusional world of myth, superstition, and fantasy that you currently inhabit. I sincerely hope that you join the rest of us in the real world before it's too late.

Magus55

Have you always been atheist foxhole? Sounds like you blame God for being the way you are and choose instead to no longer believe he exists.

Spaz

Then I'd fear god and listen to what he said and live life accordingly, I still wouldn't listen to crazy jesus people on the 700 club or something, but it would change the way I thought. Is there a benefit to god for anybody to live their life the way he wants? If he doesn't do that then I won't believe, there'd have to be some kind of proof to me to make me believe.

atheist_in_foxhole

Magus, I was born an atheist just like you were. I was, however, indoctrinated by Seventh Day Adventists (a religion that I'm sure you would dismiss as a 'cult') as a child, but when I got older I realized that religion was a sham. But that discussion is for another thread.

As for being angry with your god, that's an impossibility. How can I be angry with a fictional character?

Jayjay

I guess the closest thing would be the kind of anger you get for stupid characters in other pieces of fiction... for example, I am "angry" at Jar Jar Binks even though I am fairly certain he's not real. So In that sense, it is quite possible to be angry at mythological characters too.

(Not that this semantical detail has anything to do with the topic at hand.)

atheist_in_foxhole

Are you sure? I read an article the other day about the fact that there are currently over 2,900 cults/religions in the U.S., and I'd bet that there's at least one devoted to Jar Jar Binks. You never know, he might be real after all!

oriecat

:notworthy All hail, mighty Jar Jar, the true god of peace! :notworthy

"Meesa love yous all!"

WWSD

Feh, Jaba is the one True God.
You're going to end up as Bantha fodder if you don't watch it.