Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Vanderzyden · 10-03-2002, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QueenofSwords:

Why would god send me to hell? Because there's apparently room for only one ego in heaven.

Precisely!!!

That is actually a very, very good answer. You have made my day.

"Oh, of course. I'm wrong. Everything I say or do is wrong, according to you."

'But of course!' said the Spirit, shining with love and mirth so that my eyes were dazzled. 'That's what we all find when we reach this country. We've all been wrong! That's the great joke. There's no need to go on pretending one was right! After that we begin living.'"

-- C.S. Lewis, The Great Divorce

Vanderzyden

GeoTheo · 10-03-2002, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by QueenofSwords:
Originally posted by Starboy:
[qb]
Heaven is not a meritocracy. It is a place for god’s sycophants and toadies. 

Why would god send me to hell? Because there's apparently room for only one ego in heaven.[/QB]

That's it in a nutshell. You are 100% right. Pride is the main thing that keeps people out of heaven. Sinful pride. You have to admit you are a loser in order to be saved. Proud people don't like that.
That is related to why it is hard for a rich man (or woman) to enter. People with a lot of money tend to think they are pretty special. I'll tell you what I had a lot of problems before I became a Christian and I am glad I met Jesus Christ because I really needed him. If you think this makes me less of a person than you are, if you think it makes me a weak person then so be it. I think all the atheists here If they had seen the transformation in me when I got saved would be glad I did. I am a much better member of society now. So now I am glad i didn't have it all together when I was 21 and accepted Christ because If I did I don't think I ever would have accepted the gospel for the same reasons people here object to it. It is more appealing to rely on your self.

Vanderzyden · 10-03-2002, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by K:
Vanderzyden:

Have you really read and studied the Q'ran and the Bhagavad Gita with an open mind? If not, how can you reject them?

I have the Qu'ran on my shelf, and I have studied it. Furthermore, I have engaged many Muslims in intense debate. No, I have not read the Gita.

Vanderzyden

K · 10-03-2002, 01:45 PM

Vanderzyden:

I didn't ask if you'd read and studied it. I asked if you'd read and studied it WITH AN OPEN MIND. Did you honestly ever read the Qu'ran with the intent of being Muslim? After all, isn't that what you're asking of the atheists here in regards to the Bible?

GeoTheo · 10-03-2002, 01:47 PM

One account says Judas hung himself, one account says he bashed himself against rocks.....therfore...?
There was no Judas? How 'bout therefore the gospels represent accounts written by different people and not all copied from the same one.
I am not an inerrantist in the same strict sense as some. I find it odd that most atheists though.

Mageth · 10-03-2002, 01:48 PM

You have to admit you are a loser in order to be saved.

Great. So God created a system where only losers can get to heaven.

What an idiotic religion. If you admit you're a loser, grovel low enough, totally humiliate yourself, and kiss god's ass politely enough, maybe just maybe he'll let you in so you can do what? Continue to kiss his ass through all eternity.

QoS got it wrong; the one in your heaven is an egomaniac.

The more you guys talk (Geo, Van, and RJS) the more thoroughly I'm convinced it's all a load of crap. If that's your intention here, you're doing a good job of it.

Vanderzyden · 10-03-2002, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ron Garrett:


Challenges such as yours have been made and answered, including on this site dozens of times, and such challenges are pointless since your entire belief system is built on the mindless rejection of empiricism in favor of magical thinking. You can hardly present a challenge to disprove what you accept without proof. Proof obviously means nothing to you and you have no intention of honestly evaluating any provided. In order to even be a believer you must set the bar of credulity low for your faith and infinitely high when your fantasy is challenged.

Mindless rejection? Proof? Honesty? You know nothing about me, Ron.

The question was not "How long can you ramble on about the degrading opinions that you have of other human beings?"

No, the question was, "What is the single most obvious contradiction in the NT"?

Yes, you realize that you have been disrespectful. You are like so many here who rely upon insults and intimidation to promote your unsubstantial views.

Please avoid further attempts to distract the discussion. It would be best for you to retreat back into whatever dark, stifling world you came from (the existence of which is highly evident as I consider the tone of your post).

Vanderzyden

K · 10-03-2002, 01:55 PM

GeoTheo:

I think the main reason that atheists would insist on a literal translations of the Bible is that an omnipotent God that allowed errors in the one connection between humankind and Himself would have to be either an imbecile or a sadist.

Ron Garrett · 10-03-2002, 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by GeoTheo:
One account says Judas hung himself, one account says he bashed himself against rocks.....therfore...?
There was no Judas? How 'bout therefore the gospels represent accounts written by different people and not all copied from the same one.
I am not an inerrantist in the same strict sense as some. I find it odd that most atheists though.

I gave the Judas example in response to Vandy's inerrancy challenge on the prior page. I am well aware that the inerrantist/literalist is only a subset of Christians, though a vocal and influential one in the public arena. I would by no means assert that such ignorance is commonplace among Christians, or even universal among the right wing of the church, only that it is commonplace among the variety that ventures here to beard the lion in his den so to speak.

Mageth · 10-03-2002, 01:57 PM

And how would you know that, Starboy? Is that your opinion?

Since neither you nor starboy has any firsthand information on heaven (or hell, for that matter), whatever either of you states here concerning such is an opinion.

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10-03-2002, 01:45 PM	#114
K Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,485	Vanderzyden: I didn't ask if you'd read and studied it. I asked if you'd read and studied it WITH AN OPEN MIND. Did you honestly ever read the Qu'ran with the intent of being Muslim? After all, isn't that what you're asking of the atheists here in regards to the Bible?

10-03-2002, 01:47 PM	#115
GeoTheo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Bemidji Posts: 1,197	One account says Judas hung himself, one account says he bashed himself against rocks.....therfore...? There was no Judas? How 'bout therefore the gospels represent accounts written by different people and not all copied from the same one. I am not an inerrantist in the same strict sense as some. I find it odd that most atheists though.

10-03-2002, 01:48 PM	#116
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	You have to admit you are a loser in order to be saved. Great. So God created a system where only losers can get to heaven. What an idiotic religion. If you admit you're a loser, grovel low enough, totally humiliate yourself, and kiss god's ass politely enough, maybe just maybe he'll let you in so you can do what? Continue to kiss his ass through all eternity. QoS got it wrong; the one in your heaven is an egomaniac. The more you guys talk (Geo, Van, and RJS) the more thoroughly I'm convinced it's all a load of crap. If that's your intention here, you're doing a good job of it.

10-03-2002, 01:55 PM	#118
K Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,485	GeoTheo: I think the main reason that atheists would insist on a literal translations of the Bible is that an omnipotent God that allowed errors in the one connection between humankind and Himself would have to be either an imbecile or a sadist.

10-03-2002, 01:57 PM	#120
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	And how would you know that, Starboy? Is that your opinion? Since neither you nor starboy has any firsthand information on heaven (or hell, for that matter), whatever either of you states here concerning such is an opinion.

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