emotional

What were your expectations?

ManM

It is not a matter of expectation. I can think of nothing that would amuse me for eternity. While eternal life may be a blessing for some, I currently look on it as a curse.

One Way

Dear emotional

Not justice? According to what. According to your own standards. God Has set up standards, He expects them to be followed. Rest assured that God would not punish one second more then was neccesary. What do our sins deserve? Exactly what a holy God requires, an eternity in Hell.

Again, if you belive the Bible is wrong, then how do you know God is all-loving, how do you no He is holy. This is according to what you think He should be like. There is no basis for it. When you get me proof for it. I can recodsider.

As to your argument about the filthy dirty sinner about being still filthy! You, my friend, underestimate the merit of Christ's death. You do not belive that His death Has the power to heal completely. You have unwittingly taken for granted His death and insulted God.

Like it or not, without Christ's atoning death. Your works will get you nothing, they cannot offer peace, they cannot offer hope. Good works cannot nulify wrong.

Sincerely Ben

Biff the unclean

Hi Ben, One thing you will notice that is very different about this board than Crosswalk.com is that all Atheists are thrown off Crosswalk.
The sinner (that is everyone)
Do you even think about what this means? The self-loathing, the hatred of mankind itself. Ben, it's disgusting.
that rejects God's only son (think about it, you have just rejected His Son)
Well let's see. My son's last girl friend rejected him big time. So what should I think…these things happen, he'll get over it…or… she deserves torture and death?
If I thought the latter it would mean that I was an immoral bastard and probably crazy.
goes to hell, that is justice,
That is not justice, that's crazy.
God made a way, He gave His word, we rejected it, God says that deserves Hell.
Which means that you are saying that God is insane. You are saying that he is a clear and present danger to mankind.
As for His mercy? It still stands, believe in His Son, and you will recieve it!
That isn't mercy. That is threatening to harm someone if the don't do what you want. That's a criminal act.
If I say to you give me all your money or I'll blow your brains out I am not showing mercy because I took your money and let you live.
So far you have established your version of God to be a crazy criminal. You aren't doing a very good sales job.
God Has been merciful, He has sent His son, you either accpet it or reject it.
"Your money or your life" not my idea of mercy. Is it yours?
God can only look at those washed with Christ's blood.
Not a very good image if you don't think God is a crazy criminal.

Also, unfortunatly your salvation by good works, unfortunatly Has no basis. It is certainly not taught in the Bible! "Salvation is by grace alone, not by works so that no one may boast."
That's one of the biggest contradictions in the bible. It tells you that salvation is not by magic grace alone about the same number of times that it says it is.
But if it is by Grace alone then there can be no justice.

Biff the unclean

Not justice? According to what.
According to every definition of the word.

According to your own standards. God Has set up standards, He expects them to be followed.
OR ELSE!!!!
Which makes him a thug. Why do you worship thuggery?
Rest assured that God would not punish one second more then was neccesary. What do our sins deserve? Exactly what a holy God requires, an eternity in Hell.
Can you possibly have no idea of how hateful and how sick this superstition is?

Again, if you belive the Bible is wrong, then how do you know God is all-loving, how do you no He is holy.
This is an Atheist board, we don't believe at all.
This is according to what you think He should be like. There is no basis for it. When you get me proof for it. I can recodsider.
According to what you have posted we should all search for God. And when we find him we should kill him as we would a rabid dog.

You do not belive that His death Has the power to heal completely. You have unwittingly taken for granted His death and insulted God.
You can't insult God. There is no God. There's just you and your hate-filled story.

emotional

According to ANY standards.

http://www.losingmyreligion.com/articlesf/hell.html



What does your sick religion deserve? Eternal contempt. What does your psychopathic god deserve? Eternal disobedience.



It doesn't take the Bible to know these things. I've read it in other literature. You should read it too, and throw the Bible into the trash where it belongs.



Christ's death was a death like one of any other person. All the things said about Jesus are mythology.



No, you are the one who's insulted God. You say God tortures people in eternity. This is as good as saying God is Satan.

Like it or not, without acts of kindness towards other people, your faith will get you nothing. Faith in Christ cannot wash away one's sins.

And before you scoff: YOU WILL BELIEVE WHEN YOU GET TO THE AFTERLIFE! YOU WILL SEE THE ERROR OF YOUR WAYS!

Mageth

Originally posted by One Way
Not justice? According to what. According to your own standards.

Speaking for myself, correct. I'm more just than the god you portray. I would never consider having anyone suffer for eternity for finite "sins".

God Has set up standards, He expects them to be followed.

As I said earlier, then it's not justice, it's just a set of arbitrary standards that god's set up and expects us to keep, threatening us with eternal punishment if we don't toe the line.

Rest assured that God would not punish one second more then was neccesary. What do our sins deserve? Exactly what a holy God requires, an eternity in Hell.

So finite sins deserve eternal punishment. That's not justice; it's vindictive revenge.

Again, if you belive the Bible is wrong, then how do you know God is all-loving, how do you no He is holy. This is according to what you think He should be like. There is no basis for it. When you get me proof for it. I can recodsider.

Meanwhile, you can work on providing proof of the god you believe in. Lotsa luck.

As to your argument about the filthy dirty sinner about being still filthy! You, my friend, underestimate the merit of Christ's death. You do not belive that His death Has the power to heal completely. You have unwittingly taken for granted His death and insulted God.

To quote Koyaanisqatsi: "God sacrificed himself to himself to save us from himself." Nice plan there, God.

Umm, Christ isn't dead, according to most Christians I know. If he died, he wouldn't have been seen walking around better than ever less than 40 hours later. God didn't die at all. A man died, according to the story, but even he didn't really die, apparently.

Like it or not, without Christ's atoning death. Your works will get you nothing, they cannot offer peace, they cannot offer hope. Good works cannot nulify wrong.

So who is god gonna ask forgiveness from for sending all those people to hell to suffer for eternity for a finite life of sin? Himself?

Biff the unclean

Ben here is using a common fallacy that Webchristians love to throw at us. Usually we call them on standard debating faults (strawman, ad hom, etc) but since this one is only used by Christians and not normal debaters it has no name.
I would like to suggest one for use the next hundred times this same nonsense comes up. I propose we call it a "bogeyman" as in "the bogeyman will get you if you don't behave."

Mageth

I'd say the Bogeyman argument is an example of Argumentum ad baculum (Appeal to force). Believe or suffer the consequences!

Biff the unclean

Mmmm, that's true. But isn't Argumentum ad baculum an appeal to actual force? A Bogeyman would specifically be an appeal to imaginary force. It would be the difference of being threatened with the 7th Fleet as opposed to King Neptune.