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Old 01-29-2003, 02:43 PM   #11
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I think it goes even further.

Really good writers often state that they hate reading transcripts of their interviews, speeches, etc. Why should this be? They say it as if they can't control their spoken word with anything like the skill they express on paper.

It appears (as has been stated) that writing and speaking are two different languages. Although they share basic rules, it seems we actually compose/speak them using seperate brain components.

"Like, he was like smashing the thing"
"He's so crazy"
"I don't know!"

When written, there doesn't seem to be much to this conversation. The 'tone' could be serious, mad, or even in jest. We can use our sense of social speaking to derrive some of the meaning, but the actual communication would require far more words on the page then just what was spoken.

I find it interesting that kids using instant messanging over the internet tend to write how they speak, and utilize many many supporting catch-phrases and increased questioning to make up the differences.

IM would capture the conversation like this

"lolzz!!!, he smashed the thing"
"ahaha, what thing?"
"the thing in the hallway we were making fun of"
"ROFL"
"hes a crazy bastard, eh?"
"yea, brb"

Here, it makes sense to read, but its still in the style of social speak. Lack of context, etc. just force the typers to ask more questions before ROFLing.
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Old 01-29-2003, 08:00 PM   #12
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I think the converse is true of acquired languages. My spoken French betrays my first language through the errors I make, while my written French only stands out by far too polished for a native speaker. I couldn't write French badly if I tried.

Many of my colleagues have first languages other than English. Their spoken English can be hard to follow. Their written English may have a couple of consistent errors particular to their origins, but fundamentally they write it well in that they convey ideas accurately and clearly. It's those who grew up with English that write it execrably.

As was pointed out, written language lacks the contextual cues of speech. Logic and clarity are essential if writing is to convey thoughts without ambiguity. This has to be taught, although it is no mystery; I taught my ex-GF to write better than I do myself within a year.
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Old 01-29-2003, 08:18 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by Clutch
Now, stop that! [/B]
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Old 01-30-2003, 11:01 AM   #14
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Could this mean that written language is intrinsically more difficult than spoken language? Could bad grammar and similar phenomena be a result of written language being more difficult to generate than spoken language?
Well, I'm surprised noone said it yet, but an enormous cause for the differences between written and verbal skills is that people (especially people who are bad writers) speak and listen WAY more than they write and read. Practice makes perfect, and practice often has to be specific.

I'm a huge reader, and my written vocabulary is way bigger than my spoken, both in terms of actual usage and in actual ability (I don't know how to pronounce many of the words I know. ) Since I'm somewhat introverted and spend most of the day reading and writing, I have better writing skills than speaking. For those who don't grow up reading or writing (much) but speaking all the time, they'll have better verbal skills.

On an interesting tangent, good writing has a good "sound," too. And it's often literature which comes out of historically oral cultures which is the most pleasing in that way. Poetry is the ultimate example of this -- what started as an oral tradition graduated to a written one with enormous emphasis on "sound," but I'm also thinking of much of African American, Caribbean, etc. lit. Obviously there are lots of dead white guys with great sound, too, so don't jump all over me.
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