Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Toto · 04-27-2002, 11:57 AM

I thought I remembered the study going the other way - that there was no difference. But Google turned this up:

<a href="http://www.angelfire.com/ok2/pennielane/significa.html" target="_blank">signfica</a>

Quote:

HOW MUCH DOES YOUR SOUL WEIGH?

There is scientific evidence, claimed one scientist, that the human soul not only exists-but that the average soul weighs approximately one ounce.

In 1907, Dr. Duncan MacDougall�described a series of experiments he'd recently completed at a large hospital. MacDougall had moved the bed of a dying tuverculosis patient onto a large, sensitively balanced platform beam scale, then kept close watch on him throughout the final three hours and forty minutes of life. At the precise moment of death, the beam fell and the scale showed a �-ounce weight loss. Five more terminal patients were similarly weighted over the next two and a half years; at least three, and possibly five, also lost weight suddenly at the moment of death-between 3/8 and 1 � ounces.

The original experiment seems to be <a href="http://munshi.sonoma.edu/jamal/soulmass.html" target="_blank">here</a>, courtesy of <a href="http://www.artbell.com/duncan.html" target="_blank">Art Bell</a>.

I am a bit suspicious. This study was done in 1907, and I see no reason why it couldn't be repeated under the better measurement and controls we have now.

[ April 27, 2002: Message edited by: Toto ]

philechat · 04-27-2002, 03:06 PM

Maybe we should test it on animals? According to Christian theology only human beings have souls. So if animals also lost weight after death then perhaps animals also have souls?

Indifference · 04-27-2002, 04:16 PM

Soooo... assuming this study was correct, the soul has an actual mass. And not only does it have a mass, it is heavy enough to register on a scale? So actually, when we die, our souls fall to the floor and we're constantly walking upon the leftovers of the dead....

This doesn't seem to fit with the traditional idea of a soul.

[ April 27, 2002: Message edited by: Indifference ]

04-27-2002, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Eudaimonist:


That's a great argument for the subconscious mind, but not for an eternal component of human beings that survives biological death.

But for the eternal component to be realized only an identity shift is needed after the death of the ego consciousness. While this may sound difficult, it is very easy because there will not have much choice once we are there (see the famous "pivotal" speach made by Mark Anthony after Ceasar was slain (III,i,184-210).

The biological death will be the second death and the end of eternal life as well. Nobody should have promised anything else and if they did it was taken too far in the literal sense of the word. To be sure, the bible does not promise eternal life after the second death. Notice that eternal life is a state of mind in the absense of time-as-such.

Toto · 04-27-2002, 06:57 PM

The Art Bell article describes an experiment on dogs that showed no loss of weight.

The more I think about this, the more I think it is someone's fantasy. Almost all of the references I have seen come from Art Bell or other paranormalists. It is hard to believe that something like this, if true, would not be at least mentioned somewhere else.

04-27-2002, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sullster:
 Women did not have souls according to catholic medieval theology. They were considered the creation of the devil and souless. Later on, theologians found women's souls just like they found American Indian ones at times.

Woman, in pure form, still do not have a soul because woman are the soul to the same extent that they are woman. Mary theotokos did not have a soul but her entire being was the soul. We have an icon that displays the heart of woman to be equal to the heart of Christ. Hence, woman is the soul of Christ later to be assumed into heaven while on earth (from the TOL into the TOK).

04-27-2002, 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Koiyotnik:

People concluded that this mass displacement was a result of the soul leaving the body.

They call that "shrink" around here.

sullster · 04-28-2002, 06:06 AM

Amos, thanks for your insights from the land of mysticism and obscurity. You can go back to the magic palace now.

Koiyotnik · 04-28-2002, 06:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Amos:


They call that "shrink" around here.

Kind of like my comprehension of you, my dear boy.

04-27-2002, 04:16 PM	#13
Indifference Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 165	Soooo... assuming this study was correct, the soul has an actual mass. And not only does it have a mass, it is heavy enough to register on a scale? So actually, when we die, our souls fall to the floor and we're constantly walking upon the leftovers of the dead.... This doesn't seem to fit with the traditional idea of a soul. [ April 27, 2002: Message edited by: Indifference ]</p>

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04-27-2002, 03:06 PM	#12
philechat Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Mind of the Other Posts: 886	Maybe we should test it on animals? According to Christian theology only human beings have souls. So if animals also lost weight after death then perhaps animals also have souls?

04-27-2002, 06:57 PM	#15
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	The Art Bell article describes an experiment on dogs that showed no loss of weight. The more I think about this, the more I think it is someone's fantasy. Almost all of the references I have seen come from Art Bell or other paranormalists. It is hard to believe that something like this, if true, would not be at least mentioned somewhere else.

04-28-2002, 06:06 AM	#18
sullster Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: North of Boston Posts: 1,392	Amos, thanks for your insights from the land of mysticism and obscurity. You can go back to the magic palace now.

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