Allkholollick

We had that crap out here late in the last school year. They didn't use the "Commado" approach though. I don't remember the name that they used, I will have to ask The Wife tomorrow. She teaches out at the school and might remember the name of the group and any other particulars.

I remember the event because the kids mentioned the ripping up phone books thing and that they were inviting everyone out to another "demonstration" after school.

The Wife thought that the after school demonstration would be nice since we didn't have anything else planned and we live in Middle of Nowhere Texas. Little did she know that I had seen the tent these fools pitched out in front of one of our loonier pew-jumping churches earlier that day. I made a rather callous remark about not wanting to go to a fucking revival and we didn't attend the festivities.

I don't know how religious they were at school or how much class time was wasted. I don't think that they were very religious at school. I believe that The Wife suggested we go to the after school event in good faith. She knows of my atheism and that I wouldn't want to attend something pushing religion. She isn't a fundy either and seems pretty fair about Church/State issues at school. If there was too much (or any) religion in the group's message then I think that she would have mentioned it.

Anyway, don't mean to ramble.... I will look into the matter further.

Rusting Car Bumper

Even if they are not mentioning religion at school but only inviting them to a rally later then this still doesnt pass the Lemon test.

1) Does it have a secular purpose? One might argue yes, but the act of using a captive school audience to lure kids to what is a religious rally is not a secular purpose.

2) Does it have a secular effect? Having a rally that's motivational has a secular effect, but then again using a captive school audience to invite them to a rally is not a secular effect.

3) Does it create excessive entanglement. There is no doubt it creates excessive entanglement. First, the school uses taxpayer funds to pay a religious group. Two, they take kids class time away to deliver a message which is in part an invitation to a religious rally. (i.e. tax funds used to invite kids to a religious rally) Three, if this rally takes place in the gym after school it gives the appearance of endorsement of the groups and its message because (a) the group was invited and the message endorsed and (b) because the appearance is in the school and the invitation deliverd int he school its not clear that the school does not endorse the message.

DC

gravitybow

Is this true? I thought these groups would make their secularized invitations to the "other" venues (churches) they happen to be appearing at in order to pass the collection plate there. But they're actually getting paid by us for visiting schools? How much?

Rusting Car Bumper

This is my presumption. The video on the website has administrators endorsing them. Other websites has their appearance fees laid out.

If its a church paying them to appear at the school the problem doesnt go away. Its simply a way for the church to pay to inject its agenda into the school. (i.e. excessive engtaglement.)

DC

gravitybow

After looking at the <a href="http://www.commandosusa.com/" target="_blank">Commandos USA</a> homepage, I can't help but wonder how a devout group of Muslims using the same battle dress and tactics to bring a secularized motivational message without cost to public schools would play. I bet the community outrage would be immediate. The message really isn't in the message, is it?

Dark Jedi

<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Wanna dress up in cammies and do it?

I would wear a neck brace in Texas, cause you're gonna get lynched.

4th Generation Atheist

<strong>What is it with Texas?</strong>[/QUOTE]

What it is with Texas is that they lost 'way back in the Civil War and those portions of their demography who still think that way have responded by taking over the country today (don't let the fact that the Bush family has Connecticut roots fool you---their election winnings these days are in the South, b/c they espouse "good old boy" Southern values). Their backing comes from reactionary elements, found everywhere but concentrated in the former Confederacy, who want to "turn back the clock" to a time when blacks were subserviant, everyone was Protestant and women were barefoot/preggers/in the kitchen. Throw in the desire for "Wild West justice" and you have the makings of a full golden-age fantasy; this has taken over the minds of the Confederates and their (now our) leaders. This is what's up with Texas. It is up to the rest of us to preserve the Union victory. <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Rusting Car Bumper

Fascinating. I live in Texas and that's not the impression I have at all.

DC

[ October 01, 2002: Message edited by: DigitalChicken ]</p>

4th Generation Atheist

Maybe you're one of the ones we should airlift out when we cut the place off.

Rusting Car Bumper

Update:

It appears that word of this has been passed around. Apparently at one school some parents have complained now that it was brought to their attention. The Principal made an announcement to the students, apologized, and told the students that it was a First amendment violation.

DC