Mageth

Originally posted by Keith
Arbitrary? Can you support that?

I, and others, already have.

As I've pointed out in my scenario with the two sons and the different rules given to them, the fact that God sometimes gives different instructions to different people doesn't make God inconsistent or arbitrary.

This belongs in WinAce's "Fundies say the darnedest things" collection. [edited to correct title]

God can indeed command what he wants...but it is impossible for God to want to command evil. God can't be at war against His own nature.

All these points have been thoroughly answered many times on this thread.

God commanded the Israelites to smash the heads of babies, to kill pregnant women, and to take young virgins as slaves. If those things are not evil and are allowed by God's nature, then to hell with God. We'd be better off without him (in reality, the concept of him).

Mageth

Argumentum ad nauseum. And the same old strawman to boot. Responded to already multiple times on this thread.

You have not established any basis for objective truth in regards to morality on this thread. Indeed, your own arguments have been used to illustrate that what you have is subjective and arbitrary, and far less humane than what I and other have described as a moral basis for society. I and others have established a viable basis for a humanitarian societal consensus morality. You have defended and illustrated the same "objective" moral basis that bin Laden et al uses to justify terrorism and the Israelites used to justify genocide.

Biff the unclean

Arbitrary? Can you support that? As I've pointed out in my scenario with the two sons and the different rules given to them, the fact that God sometimes gives different instructions to different people doesn't make God inconsistent or arbitrary.
You gave your sons two different sets of rules because one is handicapped. He has a brain lesion for christ's sake.
If you just picked one to be your 'chosen' son you would be arbitrary. God has a "chosen people" the Jews. How are they any better people than the Hawaiians or the Peruvians? Are they physically handicapped somehow and need to be protected?
If he picked out one group of people for a different morality than everyone else in the world he was arbitrary.

God can indeed command what he wants...but it is impossible for God to want to command evil. God can't be at war against His own nature
Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Apparently you are assigning a nature to your mythical god that your own magic book of fairytales does not.

Pain Paien

Your scenario was bogus, and it was revealed as such when you posted it. Were you interested in actually reading the responses to your posts, you would have noticed that your point was countered, and possibly attempted to support your point. Instead, you merely repeated the same nonsense that had already been addressed repeatedly.

This is because, by your definition, whatever he says is by definition the only measure of what is good. If the same arbitrary rule were applied to humans, by definition we could never commit wrong.

Pain Paien

Of course he is. If he can't read our posts, what makes you think he can read that convoluted peice of claptrap?

luvluv

He could have chosen them for their geographical location and their location in history. The Isrealites were smack dab in the middle of ancient civilization. They had easy access to the marketplace of ideas.

I can see why not picking the Hawaiians, for example, could be defended on this regard. Further, I'm under the impression that He choose not Israel but ABRAHAM, the person, as a result of Abraham's righteousness before God. I feel that this was because of personal qualities that Abraham possessed and his location in history. If there were a better man in that region at the time, it would have probably been him. But I guess there wasn't, and thus all nations have been blessed through Abraham.

Mageth

and thus all nations have been blessed through Abraham.

The OT describes several nations in the region that weren't exactly "blessed" through Abraham.

Normal

If you anticipate those responses from the people you are arguing with, then faith isn't so much the problem as maturity. If the people are that immature why should you even care?

Keith

Keith: "God can indeed command what he wants...but it is impossible for God to want to command evil. God can't be at war against His own nature."


Biff the unclean: "Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Apparently you are assigning a nature to your mythical god that your own magic book of fairytales does not."

Keith: "If you are using this verse to show that God's nature is evil in some way, all I can tell you is that you do not interpret the bible in a very scholarly way. It might be helpful to consider the context rather than just to isolate one verse from the rest of the bible."

Keith

Good point, Paien! If the same "arbitrary" rule were applied to humans, by definition we could never commit wrong. Now I hope you understand why God--the universal and unchanging standard for goodness and righteousness, is the only standard that can possibly be true, valid, and practical for humanity.