ju'iblex

I find that entirely ironic. Have you taken it upon yourself to condemn the majority and declare your views above all others? The coin flips both ways.

you can't discuss if you're immediately disregarding opposing views as irrelevant and irrational. How freethinking is that? And if people don't like the idea of child sex, they're too sensitive? It's not kosher to speak for people, and it isn't kosher to try and guess at their motivations.

well, surely there are limits? If you can determine another feasible test for this matter then i would be delighted to hear it. But as it stands now, age is the only limiter we have, and whilst the number itself doesn't matter, a newborn baby does not have the cognitive skills of a 15 year old. there is a massive difference, and you know it.
so, if there's an anal sex discussion, we obviously need some pictures of it in action. Same with, oh, say, suicide? Pictures may have communicative properties, I'm not going to deny that. But here, there is the level of expectation that you can communicate and demonstrate your point via words. Especially when there are users on this discussion board who have been exploited in such a fashion that such pictures would prove disturbing in their message.

Pat Kelly

The only thing I have failed to do is respond to things I have no interest in responding to in exactly the same manner you choose when it suits you.

Pat Kelly

Indeed it does. This was originally your area of contention, not mine.

I refer you to your above statement regarding coins.

I have not immediately disregarded any opposing views though this is certainly not the first time I have been challenged by concepts I have already adequately dealt with previously. There is freethinking and there is hashing the same old irrational arguments over and over and over. It gets real old after awhile. I never claimed I would make a good teacher because I certainly do not have the patience.

I think you may have defined the real problem here in a nutshell. Exactly what are the limits we are trying to enforce based upon age and is there any real relationship between age and what we are really attempting to limit? As far as I can tell, aside from all the religious nonsense, what actually lies at the core of our need for limits upon sexual behavior is our need to protect each other from harm. Where I believe we have gone wrong is in our assumption that sex is in itself harmful to children and therefore children should have limits placed upon their sexuality in order to protect them from others who might involve them in sexual behavior. Instead of taking a position that sex is harmful to children until they reach a certain age we should have left sex out of the equation and stuck with the idea force and violence are harmful to children and such behavior should always have strict limits placed upon them without any qualifications related to age or sex.

Give this one up. It was a bad premise to start with which I suspect you know by now and there is no sense trying to beat a dead horse to death.

yguy

So do you see any particular reason to refrain from having sexual relations with these children of yours, other than the fact that maybe they don't turn you on? Or do you draw the line at incest?

Loren Pechtel

Why? He's advocating a position we find despicable but that's not grounds to ban him.

Loren Pechtel

We are discussing it here. I haven't looked at your site but I get the impression your site advocates it rather than discusses it. *BIG* difference!

Philosoft

I may have misread. Was your post about AquaVita's anger serious or sarcastic?

Pat Kelly

Regardless of whether I may or may not experience any sexual attractions toward my own children or anyone else’s children for that matter, there are many reasons why everyone should refrain from engaging in sexual relations with children. The biggest and most important in my eyes is the potential negative effect such an experience might have upon the child’s growing ego as they are confronted with a society that tells them such things are deplorable and wrong. Next would be the potential legal ramifications and so on and so forth. The trick as a parent today is to attempt to preserve a child’s naturally positive attitude towards sex in a world where everyone is trying to tell them how dirty and evil sex is. These subtle and not so subtle social messages can do enormous damage to the way children learn to view themselves and the world around them.

As far as one being turned on by their own children or non-spouse members of their own family, I once wrote an article that dealt with the idea of dirty diapers. Sex seems to have a component that relies at least partly upon idealistic illusion and there is nothing like familiarity or the stench of dirty sneakers to kill such illusions.

Contrary to what many seem to believe, in my opinion if we removed all legal barriers from sex tomorrow, though there may be an initial spike in sex between children and adults it would quickly fall to levels that might even be lower than current levels. The rather obvious truth is that kids and adults don’t make very good sex partners due to a difference in their needs and how they go about achieving those needs. However, this does not say that adults and children can never respond to each other sexually in a way that is mutually fulfilling or that doing so is in any way harmful. It only says there are usually far better alternatives.

xeren

I would say that having sex with a child would do more "damage to the way children learn to view themselves and the world around them" than anything else i can think of. But that's just me.

Pat Kelly

You've got my vote and I agree with you 100%

In any society that condemns childhood sexual behavior to the extent ours does there is little doubt children can be and are being very negatively affected. But do not blame this on sex. It is not sex that rejects the child but the social norms and those who feel compelled to defend those norms that do all the rejecting. In instances void of violence and force, real damage either physical or psychological rarely occurs during sex. Most of the real damage by far occurs long after the act and ironically is inflicted by the very ones claiming to protect children from harm.