Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Coragyps · 03-22-2002, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Have you read Dougal Dixon's books, Man After Man and After Man?

After Man is just too fine! Now I have to go look for the other one! Thanks, Queen!

Queen of Swords · 03-22-2002, 03:37 PM

You're welcome... but Man after Man is, to the best of my recollection, out of print. I bought it (and another Dixon alternative-history evolution book, The New Dinosaurs) from an online bookstore.

Another good book is Wayne Barlowe's Expedition, which deals with a voyage to the planet Darwin IV, where animals have evolved to be very different from Earth fauna.

three, I can't predict what life on Earth will be like in the future because evolution is influenced by the environment, and I have no idea how that's going to change. Dixon makes an assumption of nuclear war and goes on from there. What forces are going to shape the future? Pandemics, world starvation, a runaway greenhouse effect? Until I know this, I can't guess how the consequences will alter the human populations.

For the purposes of my novels, I sometimes accelerate evolution so that drastic changes in populations occur in only centuries, but there I'm god and can control all the variables.

Corwin · 03-22-2002, 03:51 PM

The only prediction I feel can be accurately made is that most predictions about human evolution will prove wrong except in the extreme short term.

New technologies such as genetic engineering, cybernetics and molecular nanotechnology will allow humanity to control our own evolution and become more or less whatever we want. (Within limits of course.) We can predict what will happen in the short term... (people already are...) but in the long run our increased technology and experience will allow us to choose evolutionary and biological advantages that haven't even occured to us yet.

tronvillain · 03-23-2002, 12:03 AM

I prefer After Man to Man After Man, but they're both pretty good.

pescifish · 03-23-2002, 09:47 AM

I don't really see the human race having enough time to evolve much, though we may actually get a chance to kick those useless wisdom teeth out in a few hundred more generations. I've always assumed we will wipe ourselves out and leave the dessicated planet to the beetles, starting over.

My favorite scifi evolution scenario is in Arthur C. Clarke's Childhoods End.

three4jump · 03-23-2002, 03:36 PM

pescifish, I think it's entirely possible that humans will wipe themselves out on one planet, but once we break out of this box, I feel it is much less likely that we will destroy ourselves on all planets simultaneously. If we can just hang on for another fifty years...

Queen of Swords · 03-23-2002, 04:15 PM

Originally posted by pescifish:
I've always assumed we will wipe ourselves out and leave the dessicated planet to the beetles 

You're optimistic.

I would have gone with the bacteria.

Coragyps · 03-23-2002, 04:17 PM

Quote:

I would have gone with the bacteria.

And scorpions. They're tough little bastards.

pescifish · 03-23-2002, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by three4jump:
but once we break out of this box, I feel it is much less likely that we will destroy ourselves on all planets simultaneously. If we can just hang on for another fifty years...

Yeah! I used to think that way too, a self-destructive race but if we spread out we'd probably thrive elsewhere. But these days I'm finding it unlikely that we will ever get off this planet in any big way.

I am curious, though -- what do you think will happen within the next 50 yrs?

three4jump · 03-23-2002, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pescifish:
Yeah! I used to think that way too, a self-destructive race but if we spread out we'd probably thrive elsewhere. But these days I'm finding it unlikely that we will ever get off this planet in any big way.

I am curious, though -- what do you think will happen within the next 50 yrs?

There are many different plans for colonizing Mars. The one I'm most familiar with is Robert Zubrin's "The Case For Mars: ThePlan To Settle The Red Planet and Why We Must." I personally plan to live on Mars, hopefully by 2020. Whether we get to Mars in 2020 or 2050, it will be a tenuous foothold either way. Only after colonies on Mars had been established for 100 years would I feel comfortable that they could survive, but if you were a Martian and you knew that every human on earth was wiped out (very unlikely, I know) you would take extra measures to safegaurd life on Mars, I think.

Incidentally, another reason I'm interested in colonizing Mars is that I think it could be beneficial to the future of human evolution. Humans have defeated one of the mechanisms of evolution--isolation of populations--by becoming so mobile. Genes travel all over the world now and mix readily. While this is a good thing in many respects, it does have an impact on the pace and mechanisms of evolution. Have a separate population on Mars would give different populations a chance to evolve differently. Possibly. Assuming we don't switch to genetic engineering first.

03-23-2002, 04:15 PM	#17
Queen of Swords Contributor Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Canada. Finally. Posts: 10,155	Originally posted by pescifish: <strong>I've always assumed we will wipe ourselves out and leave the dessicated planet to the beetles </strong> You're optimistic. I would have gone with the bacteria.

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03-22-2002, 03:37 PM	#12
Queen of Swords Contributor Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Canada. Finally. Posts: 10,155	You're welcome... but Man after Man is, to the best of my recollection, out of print. I bought it (and another Dixon alternative-history evolution book, The New Dinosaurs) from an online bookstore. Another good book is Wayne Barlowe's Expedition, which deals with a voyage to the planet Darwin IV, where animals have evolved to be very different from Earth fauna. three, I can't predict what life on Earth will be like in the future because evolution is influenced by the environment, and I have no idea how that's going to change. Dixon makes an assumption of nuclear war and goes on from there. What forces are going to shape the future? Pandemics, world starvation, a runaway greenhouse effect? Until I know this, I can't guess how the consequences will alter the human populations. For the purposes of my novels, I sometimes accelerate evolution so that drastic changes in populations occur in only centuries, but there I'm god and can control all the variables.

03-22-2002, 03:51 PM	#13
Corwin Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 4,369	The only prediction I feel can be accurately made is that most predictions about human evolution will prove wrong except in the extreme short term. New technologies such as genetic engineering, cybernetics and molecular nanotechnology will allow humanity to control our own evolution and become more or less whatever we want. (Within limits of course.) We can predict what will happen in the short term... (people already are...) but in the long run our increased technology and experience will allow us to choose evolutionary and biological advantages that haven't even occured to us yet.

03-23-2002, 12:03 AM	#14
tronvillain Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 5,658	I prefer After Man to Man After Man, but they're both pretty good.

03-23-2002, 09:47 AM	#15
pescifish Beloved Deceased Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: rural part of los angeles, CA Posts: 4,516	I don't really see the human race having enough time to evolve much, though we may actually get a chance to kick those useless wisdom teeth out in a few hundred more generations. I've always assumed we will wipe ourselves out and leave the dessicated planet to the beetles, starting over. My favorite scifi evolution scenario is in Arthur C. Clarke's Childhoods End.

03-23-2002, 03:36 PM	#16
three4jump Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Useless Bay Posts: 1,434	pescifish, I think it's entirely possible that humans will wipe themselves out on one planet, but once we break out of this box, I feel it is much less likely that we will destroy ourselves on all planets simultaneously. If we can just hang on for another fifty years...

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