Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Steven Carr · 04-11-2006, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by punk77

On a related note I have read of an apologist saying that part of the Bible used the Jewish way of counting (a day was sunset to sunset) and other parts of the Bible used a Roman way of counting (midnight to midnight). Did Romans actually measure time like that in those days or is this just made-up?

It is made up. The Roman day started at midnight, but the hours were not counted from them.

Both Romans and Jews divided the daylight up into 12 hours, and the night into 3 or 4 watches.

Doesn't Jesus say in John 'Are there not 12 hours of daylight?'

Hallandale · 04-11-2006, 09:43 AM

When trying to prove that Jesus was resurrected, Christians have always relied on the empty tomb as proof that Jesus was resurrected.
If a body were missing from a mortuary, would you assume that miraculously the dead body was resurrected and the deceased had gone on his way? I seriously doubt it.
My cousin, Kathy, moved to California, and wanted to move the body of my uncle from a cemetery in New Jersey to one in California close to where she was now residing. She went through a lot of legal haggling and eventually secured a court order to move the body. When they dug where the body was supposed to be, the coffin and body were missing. You may have read about this in your newspaper when my cousin sued. My family jokes about Uncle Ed being resurrected, and my Aunt Peggy claims she saw him in the stands while watching a football game on TV, but nobody seriously believes that he is walking around somewhere wearing the new suit he was buried in.

Nick Hallandale
enterprisestrategy@earthlink.net

punk77 · 04-11-2006, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Carr

It is made up. The Roman day started at midnight, but the hours were not counted from them.

Both Romans and Jews divided the daylight up into 12 hours, and the night into 3 or 4 watches.

Doesn't Jesus say in John 'Are there not 12 hours of daylight?'

Thanks for the reply

.

Julian · 04-11-2006, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Julian

Apparently, counting the days rubbed some ancient scribes the wrong way so in some manuscripts we see 'on the third day' changed to 'after three days.' I don't have my references here so I can't give specific manuscript information.

Julian

It turns out this kinda information is online.

In Matthew 16:21, 17:23 but, strangely enough, not in 20:19 or 27:64 and no variations on this theme in Luke. *shrug* Anyways, here it is:

τῇ τρίτῃ ἡμέρᾳ (Byz ς WH)
μετὰ τρεῖς ἡμέρας (D it syr^s cop^bo)

Julian

ChandraRama · 04-12-2006, 07:14 PM

Quote:

Absolute certainty about the location cannot be given because of the disruptions of the site from the time of the first coming of Christ until the Byzantine period that began some 300 years later. .... With all of this religious decoration, it is difficult to conceive of where the tomb is, or how Golgotha is related to it.

If the scripture does not remain uncorrupted, Bart Ehrman says, that the God did not inspire it in the first place.
In the same token, if those places could not be kept uncorrupted by the all powerful God, should not we deduce that the God did not act anything in those places?

robto · 04-13-2006, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by openlyatheist

Then he walked directly into a cell that had iron bars and obviously had been around for awhile. He claimed that he was standing directly in the tomb from which Jesus rose from the dead.

If he said this on TV and this

Quote:

Absolute certainty about the location cannot be given...

on his own website...

How dishonest can you get?

EthnAlln · 04-14-2006, 01:24 PM

I've seen a few minutes (all I can stand at a stretch) many times. The times I've caught him he seems to be most interested in boosting Christian support for modern-day Israel. I'm guessing the conversion isn't quite complete.

But to answer your question, anybody can speak with great authority and declare any convenient landmark to be the tomb of Jesus. I hope he wasn't also selling pieces of the True Cross.

Joan of Bark · 04-15-2006, 06:55 AM

In the old city of Jerusalem, there are landmarks declaring the route Jesus took on the way to his crucifixion. Yeah, CNN was on hand to record it all. Tourist dollars are an amazing motivation to those looking for relics.

04-14-2006, 01:24 PM	#17
EthnAlln Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Burlington, Vermont Posts: 5,179	Levitt is a converted Jew I've seen a few minutes (all I can stand at a stretch) many times. The times I've caught him he seems to be most interested in boosting Christian support for modern-day Israel. I'm guessing the conversion isn't quite complete. But to answer your question, anybody can speak with great authority and declare any convenient landmark to be the tomb of Jesus. I hope he wasn't also selling pieces of the True Cross.

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04-11-2006, 09:43 AM	#12
Hallandale Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Fort Pierce Florida Posts: 52	When trying to prove that Jesus was resurrected, Christians have always relied on the empty tomb as proof that Jesus was resurrected. If a body were missing from a mortuary, would you assume that miraculously the dead body was resurrected and the deceased had gone on his way? I seriously doubt it. My cousin, Kathy, moved to California, and wanted to move the body of my uncle from a cemetery in New Jersey to one in California close to where she was now residing. She went through a lot of legal haggling and eventually secured a court order to move the body. When they dug where the body was supposed to be, the coffin and body were missing. You may have read about this in your newspaper when my cousin sued. My family jokes about Uncle Ed being resurrected, and my Aunt Peggy claims she saw him in the stands while watching a football game on TV, but nobody seriously believes that he is walking around somewhere wearing the new suit he was buried in. Nick Hallandale enterprisestrategy@earthlink.net

04-15-2006, 06:55 AM	#18
Joan of Bark Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Pua, in northern Thailand Posts: 2,823	In the old city of Jerusalem, there are landmarks declaring the route Jesus took on the way to his crucifixion. Yeah, CNN was on hand to record it all. Tourist dollars are an amazing motivation to those looking for relics.

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