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Old 01-06-2005, 09:42 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by andrewcriddle
Passages like John 7:15 seem to represent Jesus as without a formal education but knowing considerably more about the Hebrew Bible than an illiterate man would be expected to. Hence presumably he is regarded as having at least basic literacy.

How far such passages provide reliable information about the historical Jesus is another matter.

Andrew Criddle
I agree that it's unlikely that a country bumpkin like Jesus (assuming he existed) would have had access to formal education but the story of his lecture in the temple suggests that he was a child prodigy who could have taught himself to read and write.
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Old 01-06-2005, 10:36 AM   #12
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He could conceivably be a scriptural prodigy without being literate. It's not unusual for non-literate people to develop extraordinary facilities with verbal memory and mnemonic devices for recalling extensive amounts of orally learned text. A bright kid who spent a lot of time in the synagogue could probably pick up a lot of scriptural knowledge and be able to cite passages from memory. It might not have even been all that unusual. What might make a kid 'prodigious" would be an ability to summon up scriptural arguments in a clever (especially if it included an appropos quotation from the Torah or from a prophet) way to defeat a few blowhards in the verbal jousting that was common in synagogues as well as the Temple.

I suppose that, to draw an analogy, it might be comparable to a very bright kid who watches a lot of Court TV and learns enough trial procedure to be able make a clever argument in a legal debate with a real lawyer or cite a surprisingly on point precedent from memory. A REALLY precocious kid might really be able to impress somebody.

In the case of Jesus at the Temple (or any of the exchanges with Pharisees) we have an apocryphal story which is not meant to convey that Jesus had formal training but just the opposite- that this hick from Galilee was able to defeat those fancy, pompous scholars from Jerusalem.
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Old 01-06-2005, 10:44 AM   #13
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Someone mentioned this earlier. Would it have been possible for Jesus, even though he was a peasant, to have been trained to read and write by the Essenes? Were the Essenes class conscious?
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Old 01-07-2005, 10:00 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Diogenes the Cynic
He could conceivably be a scriptural prodigy without being literate. It's not unusual for non-literate people to develop extraordinary facilities with verbal memory and mnemonic devices for recalling extensive amounts of orally learned text. A bright kid who spent a lot of time in the synagogue could probably pick up a lot of scriptural knowledge and be able to cite passages from memory. It might not have even been all that unusual. What might make a kid 'prodigious" would be an ability to summon up scriptural arguments in a clever (especially if it included an appropos quotation from the Torah or from a prophet) way to defeat a few blowhards in the verbal jousting that was common in synagogues as well as the Temple.

I suppose that, to draw an analogy, it might be comparable to a very bright kid who watches a lot of Court TV and learns enough trial procedure to be able make a clever argument in a legal debate with a real lawyer or cite a surprisingly on point precedent from memory. A REALLY precocious kid might really be able to impress somebody.

In the case of Jesus at the Temple (or any of the exchanges with Pharisees) we have an apocryphal story which is not meant to convey that Jesus had formal training but just the opposite- that this hick from Galilee was able to defeat those fancy, pompous scholars from Jerusalem.
Your explanation seems much more plausible. However, Jesus would have had to spend a lot of time at temple in order to memorize scripture and develop his arguments. Would that have been tolerated?
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Old 01-07-2005, 11:04 AM   #15
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Your explanation seems much more plausible. However, Jesus would have had to spend a lot of time at temple in order to memorize scripture and develop his arguments. Would that have been tolerated?
I don't think there's much evidence he spent much time at the Temple in Jerusalem but local synagogues in Galilee probably would have been sufficient to hear some readings and learn some things, and from what I've read, the synagogues were pretty open and casual.
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