FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > Religion (Closed) > Biblical Criticism & History
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Today at 03:12 PM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-06-2006, 01:08 PM   #121
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Palm Springs, California
Posts: 10,955
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hinduwoman View Post
what did the Jews believe about the fall before Christianity came on the scene? That would resolve all problems, unless there are not enough materials.

Until then a devout Christian's opinion on how Jews regard their religion is just that --- opinion, particulalry when it clashes with what actual Jews say.
Judaism was in flux in the first century when Christianity arose. It's quite defensible to state that the rise of Christianity gave birth to the form of Judaism takes today. Clearly, for the next 1000 years Judaism developed along side and in response to Christianity, which quickly outpaced it in size and influence.

If this is true, for all those who say Paul "invented" Christianity, they may have to conclude that Paul "invented" modern Judaism. Not bad for a tentmaker from Tarsus.
Gamera is offline  
Old 09-07-2006, 07:21 AM   #122
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Georgia
Posts: 1,729
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamera View Post

Since the Hebrew scriptures as a whole make it clear that God is the God of truth (and indeed God's truth is contrasted with Satan and his lies), it seems very unlikely that a depiction of God as a liar would go unnoticed by those putting these narrative together.
In my last two posts I showed you some examples of scriptures that are in the text now that unambigously depict God as a liar. You completely dodged addressing every one of those scriptures. Until you address those, there is really not much more to say.
pharoah is offline  
Old 09-07-2006, 03:00 PM   #123
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: New York State
Posts: 440
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anat View Post
I am not aware of a Jewish source that puts much emphasis on hell at all.
The Book of Enoch and various other Hellenistic-Jewish apocalyptic sources have detailed eschatology and demonology. This concept was lost by later Rabbinic Judaism, but retained by Christianity. As the author of Daniel was clearly a member of a similar Jewish apocalyptic school of thought, he likely held similar ideas, although he does not explicitly describe his eschatology the way the contemporary author of Enoch does. IMO this is a great example of how fluid the Jewish "canon" was at the time of early Christianity.
rob117 is offline  
Old 09-07-2006, 05:25 PM   #124
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: home
Posts: 3,715
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gamera
Since the Hebrew scriptures as a whole make it clear that God is the God of truth (and indeed God's truth is contrasted with Satan and his lies), it seems very unlikely that a depiction of God as a liar would go unnoticed by those putting these narrative together.
The Satan makes very few appearances in the HB. He does appear more in Midrash, and he isn't really much of a liar but more a transmiter of brutal truth (like when the Satan tells Sarah about Abraham binding Isaac on the altar, causing Sarah to die).
Anat is offline  
Old 09-08-2006, 09:41 AM   #125
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: NYC
Posts: 10,532
Default

From Gamera:
Quote:
they may have to conclude that Paul "invented" modern Judaism.
Yeah. Kind of like the way hitler "invented" Israel.

RED DAVE
RED DAVE is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:32 PM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.