steve_bnk

The question was not an HJ, but does the story makes sense of a radical political rabai in the times. I think it does.

Looking at it through the lens of our modern politics, he appeared to be at what we'd might call the university level comming from a background in which his peers would have been largely nilliterate or functionaly literate. He was literate and able to debate in the temple against the core of the establishment rabais. His story was that of an ordinary family on the margins of society.

Old Abe did his arithmentic with charcoal on a shvle as I read as a kid, and George Washington really cut down the cherry tree?

If he had been a bastard child a cover story would have been needed else he would not have been able to overcome the scandle. The basics of politics and social image shaping is likley as old as human civilization.

The image 12 apostles as the 12 tribes folowing JC would have been inescapable.

As to things like miracles, we only have to look around today. The Maharishi and Transcendental Meditation. There are TM people who have never seen anyone levitate but will swear it exists, the TM folks give or at least used to give levltation classes. I exchaged with someone who never met the Bahgwan of Antelope Oregon fame, but swore he was a holy man, not someone who was on the run from the Indian IRS.

The tale around a popular political activist would have spun itself. Curing someone's psychosomatic ills would morph into casting demons into pigs.

As a politcal figure makes perfect sense.

steve_bnk

Anything is possible, but given the times, the general literacy level, and comunications of the times, I'd say the odds of a conspiracy that fabricated the gosples out of nothing is far less probable.

Toto

No conspiracy is required. The gospels were not fabricated out of "nothing" - they were based on the Septuagint.

And what about the times? Does it make sense to have an apocalyptic preacher predict the destruction of the Temple in 40 CE? What happened at that time that would make sense of that prediction?

aa5874

But, ISN'T your radical political rabbi an HJ, or are you talking about a heavenly radical political rabbi?

But, there is already a documented case of an apocalyptic character in the writings of Josephus. So, we have an idea of the manner in which apocalyptic Jews were treated by their own people.

Jesus son of Ananus was beaten to a pulp and declared a madmen for predicting some calamity for the Jerusalem.

It is very likely that many Jews after having read or heard the Hebrew Scripture or Septuagint may have also believed that some calamity was predicted by the prophets like Isaiah, Jeremiah and others

It must be understood that the apocalyptic words of Jesus was LIFTED straight out of writings available for hundreds of years.

Jews knew about these prohecies long, long time before the Jesus stories were ever written. Jesus's so-called prophecies were NOT anything new.

Jesus probably would have been considered a babbler repeating the same apocalyptic themes that have failed to have materialised for hundreds of years.

steve_bnk

I know the commonilty between the NT words and the OT, however is it not just as likley that a politicaly motivated Jew would learn the Jewish scriptures and make use of them? Not much differnt than some of our Christian politicians who want to sway Christians. Invoking the OT prophets is stock and trade in Chrtistianity today.

I would think there would be a few more than one crazy Jew beaten by a mob, that kind of punishment was comonplace in their culture.

How does Josephus pass for documented historical evidence?

Loomis

What are you basing this on?

I already showed you John 10:34 where he fucked up Psalm 82.

Are you just going to ignore it?

Loomis

Can you give us an example where ‘Jesus’ used the ‘Jewish scriptures’ in a way that you are describing?

Let’s take a look.

Loomis

In case anyone cares the antelope is saying, "I am the original Jesus Christ. But evil men have distorted my story."

steve_bnk

The golden rule/maxim appears I believe in Leviticus for one. Pretty much most of the sentiments JC(allegedly) spoke can be found in the Old Testament, in that sense he was again a throwback to the older prophets. As presented he was a literate Jew in Jewish culture called a rabai. On would think he would then know and draw on Jewish writings and traditions.

He was calling the Jews back to the old ways, so to speak, he was not inventing anything new or extreme.

steve_bnk

Just the general profile as I see it. You can find any number of inconsistencies in the texts, that is a given. As is obvious none of the gospels are journalistic or historical reports, and were not likley intended as such.

One that comes to mind from the commentary with the NSRV is that architecture desribed in some places in the gosples do not natch the period.