No Robots

Christ's whole message is that what makes a man what he is are not those external conditions that lie beyond his control, but his own process of inner self-perfection.

Does the designation of Christ as a mystic seem unreasonable to you?

"The Father" is Christ's term for the wholly abstract spiritual unity constituting reality in its essence. It has been called by others the One, the Absolute, Being, Brahman, Dao and Logos. The essence of every mystic's experience is self-identification with this abstract spiritual unity.

WishboneDawn

I'd heard of John the Baptist possibly being Qumran but not Jesus. Possibly Pharisee on the idea that we are most critical to those we know best.

sharon45

I don't know about this, but he was constantly challenged on his claims of a supposed expertise and authority when it comes to god's word, wisdom, and commands.

sharon45

Short time as in being only based on this recent moment because I have had many answers to you before but I am not going to remember in those dealings if I ever brought up a quote.

Of course the mere quote doesn't provide that his is not humble all to itself, but it also dosen't provide as to any kind of backing that he is indeed humble just because he wishes to state it openly. As a start, one annoucing that they are humble without first being asked or challenged on the idea should instead counter the declaration.

This is not correct according to the NT. His supposed origin is instead of an extremely high order and he is just "slumming it" through this time period, but he still always remains fully aware of his true placement and purpose.

So you are saying he was only giving the Pharisees and many from the different crowd settings a loving little push? He presents one assertion after another without having it solidly supported much past his bare say-so.
He states himself as the only way to god, that he is one with god, that he is the Messiah and so forth without bothering to provide actual evidence of how this is to be. To the contrary, he displays much in opposition to his pronouncements.

He doesn't even treat his disciples on numerous occasions with enough respect and patience though they are clearly shown in most cases eager to serve and please him.
Well going into enough detail might take it off topic but it still does show more towards jesus not being humble since there aren't any strong agruments given by the NT to give these concepts any actual validity.

sharon45

True, but jesus didn't really pass the test over not being a false prophet, so he had no prue suit to warrent any such audacious aspirations.

sharon45

How does this pertain to his obsession with his own death and resurrection? Is it all just merely symbolic and that one has to shed their former selves to properly evolve?
A hustler would be more like it.
Well this supposed "father" has a few apparent speaking roles in the the NT. Jesus also surmises many properties associated with this "father" and levels to others his personal contention that they don't follow or know of this "father" simply because they don't know him. Which is a lie since they are clearly paying attention to his ramblings based on their answers and actions given during these altercations.

ksen

If I'm mistaken then I apologize.

Jesus was telling His disciples that so they wouldn't be uncomfortable approaching Him thinking that He would reject them. He was trying to comfort their fears.

Here is what Paul wrote about it:

Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. - Php 2:5-8 (KJV)

Even though Christ was King of the Universe and deserving of great honor and respect He instead humbled Himself and came in the form of a servant in order to die for those who hated Him......according to the Scriptures.

He did provide evidence. He provided the testimony of the Scriptures, the testimony of His miracles, the testimony of John the Baptist, the testimony of Moses, and the testimony of the Father (John 5:31-47).

Where?

Please define what you think humbleness or lowliness of heart is so I can figure out what it is you expected to see out of the record of Jesus' life to decide if He was truly humble or not.

sharon45

As I've said, his disciples were somehow already willing servents of his. Now if he didn't lose patience so much and quickly reprimand them and without the constant talk about such things as the coming persecutions then this might make a good deal more sense.

Again showing that he wasn't humble. Why is it not completely enough to be the supposed "King of the Universe"? How does this self-proclaimed placement automatically garner one great honor and respect? Honor and respect are truly earned and one does not earn such obvious high praise for simply being exactly as they are. Especially when it is already wriiten that even if he decided to not continue with this supposed mission, he wouldn't be look upon as anything less.

No, this is not really conveyed. He instead came to lecture, judge (even though he claims this isn't the case, but afterall, it is really about all that is presented), and perform some more devious things. The idea of the servant is yet another one of his claims, which again is not supported.

One first has to actually establish a specific target of task that is in need of service and then come fully equipped with the means and qualifications to truly accomplish it. Scripturally, he falls flat in this attempt and I had already gave you part of this reason from the quoting of Genesis 4:6-7 earlier.

Which mostly disagree.Which are irrelevant.Again this does not pertain since he is displayed with no true scriptural support.Yes, he does talk some about Moses, but he does not show how he has any real relation to or support from Moses. This also isn't worth much since again it is all based only around his bald charge which he doesn't have the means to realistically back it up with scripture.

One of the earliest examples is matthew 8:23-26.

23 Then he got into the boat and his disciples followed him.
24 Without warning, a furious storm came up on the lake, so that the waves swept over the boat. But Jesus was sleeping.
25 The disciples went and woke him, saying, "Lord, save us! We're going to drown!"
26 He replied, "You of little faith, why are you so afraid?" Then he got up and rebuked the winds and the waves, and it was completely calm.

Until he ever takes the necessary time to properly teach, assure, and demonstrate his abilities and authority, he has really no case in these matters to judge.

You gave enough of one earlier...
One that at least does not insist on demonstrating this kind of character.

EthnAlln

I'm afraid I don't remember the source. I read it in study hall in high school, which means it was some time in the 1950s. The author pointed out how much of the Sermon on the Mount reflected the wording of the Essene Teacher of Righteousness, who was crucified by the Romans around 100 BCE. Of course, he needn't have been actually in the brotherhood to pick up its doctrines.