Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Sai · 09-21-2009, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

The rebirth of Israel foretold by the Bible.

Jeremiah 30:3 For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.

Joel 3:1-2 For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem, I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and [for] my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.

Ezekiel 36:24,33-35 24For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. 33"Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day that I shall have cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause you to dwell in the cities, and the wastes shall be builded. 34And the desolate land shall be tilled, whereas it lay desolate in the sight of all that passed by. 35And they shall say, This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities are become fenced, and are inhabited.

Amos 9:11 In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old:

Moses predicted that the Jews would be scattered throughout the world and persecuted as has occurred for the last three thousand years and that one day the Jews would return to God and to the land of Israel which he promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

In fulfillment of Bible prophecy for the End Times, this occurred on May 15, 1948 as the United Nations officially recognized Israel as a sovereign nation, a major sign of Christ's nearness.

Moderators; I don't know if my verses are considered preaching, but I must reveal Biblical verses to confirm modern-day prophecy.

IBIH- would you please deal with your statement that the Euphrates has "dried up" when it has not, and that it "evaporated" when it didnt?

Keith&Co. · 09-21-2009, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

The Euphrates is drying up.

You keep switching between 'is in the act of drying up' and 'is dried up.'
The complete lack of water flow is crucial to the prophecy that you keep saying has already been fulfilled. But it hasn't been.

Quote:

Some officials worry that it could soon be half of what it is now.

Half isn't dry, though, is it?

Quote:

The shrinking of the Euphrates, a river so crucial to the birth of civilization that the Book of Revelation prophesied its drying up as a sign of the end times.

But that's not really the center of civilization any more, is it? There are other rivers that would be more worrying if they stopped flowing. The Amazon, and the big oxygen-producing forest there, for one.

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It doesn't matter how or why the Euphrates is drying up.

No, but what DOES matter is that it's not drying up. The prophecy isn't fullfilled.

Quote:

I don't care if Syria or Turkey can make the Euphrates gain water once again. That doesn't matter.

It certainly does. If they do, then the prophecy drops from an immediate sign to 'will happen later' promise. We will NOT be in the end times.

You're adamant that the End Times couldn't happen before Isreal was recreated. But you're wishy-washy on the state of the river, though the prophecy is clear.

Eh, i never really thought you'd seen any error in your ways, despite the countering evidence. I probably should have made a prophecy about that...

IBelieveInHymn · 09-21-2009, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sai

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

The rebirth of Israel foretold by the Bible.

Jeremiah 30:3 For, lo, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will bring again the captivity of my people Israel and Judah, saith the LORD: and I will cause them to return to the land that I gave to their fathers, and they shall possess it.

Joel 3:1-2 For, behold, in those days, and in that time, when I shall bring again the captivity of Judah and Jerusalem, I will also gather all nations, and will bring them down into the valley of Jehoshaphat, and will plead with them there for my people and [for] my heritage Israel, whom they have scattered among the nations, and parted my land.

Ezekiel 36:24,33-35 24For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. 33"Thus saith the Lord GOD; In the day that I shall have cleansed you from all your iniquities I will also cause you to dwell in the cities, and the wastes shall be builded. 34And the desolate land shall be tilled, whereas it lay desolate in the sight of all that passed by. 35And they shall say, This land that was desolate is become like the garden of Eden; and the waste and desolate and ruined cities are become fenced, and are inhabited.

Amos 9:11 In that day will I raise up the tabernacle of David that is fallen, and close up the breaches thereof; and I will raise up his ruins, and I will build it as in the days of old:

Moses predicted that the Jews would be scattered throughout the world and persecuted as has occurred for the last three thousand years and that one day the Jews would return to God and to the land of Israel which he promised to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

In fulfillment of Bible prophecy for the End Times, this occurred on May 15, 1948 as the United Nations officially recognized Israel as a sovereign nation, a major sign of Christ's nearness.

Moderators; I don't know if my verses are considered preaching, but I must reveal Biblical verses to confirm modern-day prophecy.

IBIH- would you please deal with your statement that the Euphrates has "dried up" when it has not, and that it "evaporated" when it didnt?

This debate is about "Israel becoming a Nation in the end of days".

Goto the next thread, you will see I have explained this thoroughly.

Please, don't think I'm hiding anything, or neglecting the questions.

And I never said "the Euphrates has DRIED up"... I said "It is drying up", as foretold by John.

Sai · 09-21-2009, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith&Co.

Flowing Again?
It's flowing NOW! The rate has dropped, but the 'flow' of water has never, ever stopped. It's not evaporating, it's not evaporated, it's just blocked.

Oh, and:

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp...ziUQcNToKyM_tw

The Euphrates is drying up. Strangled by the water policies of Iraq’s neighbors, Turkey and Syria; a two-year drought; and years of misuse by Iraq and its farmers, the river is significantly smaller than it was just a few years ago. Some officials worry that it could soon be half of what it is now.

The shrinking of the Euphrates, a river so crucial to the birth of civilization that the Book of Revelation prophesied its drying up as a sign of the end times. http://www.1913intel.com/2009/07/14/...-is-drying-up/

It doesn't matter how or why the Euphrates is drying up. That is irrelevant. The Book of Revelation said this day would happen, and it's happening.

I don't care if Syria or Turkey can make the Euphrates gain water once again. That doesn't matter. The point you're missing is, John said this specific river would dry up before the return of Christ. And it's happening. There is no rebuttal to this event.

The Euphrates River is literally now able to be completely "dried up" as predicted for the end times. This is because of the $32 billion Anatolia Dam Project in southeastern Turkey, which began in the late 1980's, and is projected to be completed by the year 2010.

Isnt there a pretty big difference between what CAN happen, and what you said already HAD happened? If I report to the fire dept that my house IS on fire, and when they arrive I say that it CAN happen and isnt that the same thing... I think they will be irritated.

Im really curious why you would say that the river already did dry up when it didnt. Is that like saying you saw a meteor when you really didnt?

You ought to care if Syria and Turkey release more water, or it rains more. Coz it wrecks the whole prophesy bit. Sounds like a case of I dont care what the facts are, I know what i want to think.

Anyway...http://www.kurdishglobe.net/displayA...7EFA2FC5457D50

spamandham · 09-21-2009, 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

In fulfillment of Bible prophecy for the End Times, this occurred on May 15, 1948 as the United Nations officially recognized Israel as a sovereign nation, a major sign of Christ's nearness.

What an amazing coincidence that they decided to name it Israel! Either that, or dispensationalists and zionists were the driving force behind the creation of the modern secular state of Israel, trying to force the fulfillment of prophecy.

Congratulations on proving that in 1948, Christians dominated world politics.

premjan · 09-21-2009, 09:57 AM

A lot of rivers are drying up.

IBelieveInHymn · 09-21-2009, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith&Co.

You keep switching between 'is in the act of drying up' and 'is dried up.'

I have said all along, "It's happening". I have never said "the river is completely gone". The water in the river is gone due to the Iraqi's misuse and the dam project.

Quote:

The complete lack of water flow is crucial to the prophecy that you keep saying has already been fulfilled. But it hasn't been.

I've said all along this is a prophecy foretold in the bible. The river will dry up in the end of days, and I've said all along.. 'it's happening as we speak". I never said the entire river is completely gone.

Quote:

Half isn't dry, though, is it?
But that's not really the center of civilization any more, is it? There are other rivers that would be more worrying if they stopped flowing. The Amazon, and the big oxygen-producing forest there, for one.

Ugh, the reason why John predicted the Euphrates is because it's the birthplace of human civilization. I'm not concerned about other rivers at this moment.

Quote:

No, but what DOES matter is that it's not drying up. The prophecy isn't fullfilled.

Yes, it IS drying up, due to mis-use by the Iraqi farmers.

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It certainly does. If they do, then the prophecy drops from an immediate sign to 'will happen later' promise. We will NOT be in the end times.

They have worked on this dam since the early 1980s, and they have spent nearly 32 billion dollars on this project. What do you think?

Quote:

You're adamant that the End Times couldn't happen before Isreal was recreated. But you're wishy-washy on the state of the river, though the prophecy is clear.

That's right. The end of the World wasn't possible until the rebirth of Israel.

Quote:

Eh, i never really thought you'd seen any error in your ways, despite the countering evidence. I probably should have made a prophecy about that...

What evidence do you have against me? I have shown you pictures of a little kid kneeling down in a bed of dirt where the Euphrates once ran rapidly.

I think you are putting words in my mouth to suit your argument, and you're splitting hairs on this debate.

IBelieveInHymn · 09-21-2009, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spamandham

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

In fulfillment of Bible prophecy for the End Times, this occurred on May 15, 1948 as the United Nations officially recognized Israel as a sovereign nation, a major sign of Christ's nearness.

What an amazing coincidence that they decided to name it Israel! Either that, or dispensationalists and zionists were the driving force behind the creation of the modern secular state of Israel, trying to force the fulfillment of prophecy.

Congratulations on proving that in 1948, Christians dominated world politics.

Are you suggesting that Christians named "Israel" in 1948 just to fit into Biblical prophecy? That's absurd!

aupmanyav · 09-21-2009, 10:14 AM

Jesus never said that. That prophecy was from YHWH, the God of the Jews. He definitely fulfilled what he said. Should I follow YHWH or Jesus?

Keith&Co. · 09-21-2009, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith&Co.

You keep switching between 'is in the act of drying up' and 'is dried up.'

I have said all along, "It's happening". I have never said "the river is completely gone". The water in the river is gone due

That's so cute.
The water is gone is a binary statement, made without qualifiers. But the water is not gone.
You've also said:

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

2. The Euphrates River has run dry in 2009.

Quote:

Originally Posted by IBelieveInHymn

Yes, when the Euphrates is flowing once again,

It hasn't run dry, and it's never stopped flowing.

Quote:

I've said all along this is a prophecy foretold in the bible. The river will dry up in the end of days, and I've said all along.. 'it's happening as we speak". I never said the entire river is completely gone.

You have said that the 'river run dry' prophecy has. Been. Fulfilled. Not nearly fulfilled. If you don't wish to be seen as one who makes misstatements, them spend more care on the statements you make.

Quote:

Yes, it IS drying up, due to mis-use by the Iraqi farmers.

It's low. But you're predicting something that may not happen. Your whole 'end times' judgment is based on evidence that hasn't yet been provided.

Quote:

They have worked on this dam since the early 1980s, and they have spent nearly 32 billion dollars on this project. What do you think?

After a few moments staring at this line, trying to figure out how the hell it fits into the whole post, i realize that you apparently know little about dams. Dams let water run through. They have to. One way or another, through control sluices or over the top when the waters surmount them. They can finish the dam AND keep an amount of water running downstream.

Quote:

Eh, i never really thought you'd seen any error in your ways, despite the countering evidence. I probably should have made a prophecy about that...

What evidence do you have against me? I have shown you pictures of a little kid kneeling down in a bed of dirt where the Euphrates once ran rapidly.

OOoooh. Pictures. Those are so compelling in all your threads. I'd rather concentrate on the cubic meters of water per second that are still flowing in the river. It's not dry, prophecy hasn't been fulfilled, and you appear to be standing firm and proud in the ranks of the lunatic fringe.

Quote:

I think you are putting words in my mouth to suit your argument, and you're splitting hairs on this debate.

Debate? You make a claim and it doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Again.

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09-21-2009, 09:57 AM	#16
premjan Obsessed Contributor Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: NJ Posts: 61,538	A lot of rivers are drying up.

09-21-2009, 10:14 AM	#19
aupmanyav Contributor Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: New Delhi, India Posts: 18,926	Jesus never said that. That prophecy was from YHWH, the God of the Jews. He definitely fulfilled what he said. Should I follow YHWH or Jesus?

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