FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > Religion (Closed) > Biblical Criticism & History
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Today at 03:12 PM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 11-21-2007, 10:39 PM   #1
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Bli Bli
Posts: 3,135
Default Mark 1:1 and the son of god.

Mark 1:11 The beginning of the gospel about Jesus Christ, the Son of God

It has been suggested by some that the words "son of god" in Mark 1:1 were a later addition and that the Mark in it's original form did not include these words, and that the words were added due to an evolving christology.
Part of the argument is that these words are absent from Codexes Sinaiticus, 375 CE and Koridethi , 9th century.

However the words are present in Codex Vaticanus ,c 325 AD Irenaus ,c 185 CE uses it apparently the Diatessaron c 170CE has them and the Old Latin Codex Vercellensis c 360 CE .

On this basis there doesn't seem to be much of a case, so is there more to it?
judge is offline  
Old 11-22-2007, 07:54 AM   #2
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Nazareth
Posts: 2,357
Default Godfather Part Jew. Sonny is Dead.

JW:

http://www-user.uni-bremen.de/~wie/TCG/TC-Mark.pdf

[JW Excerpts]

Quote:
TVU 1

...

NA27 Mark 1:1 VArch. tou/ euvaggeli,ou VIhsou/ Cristou/[Îui`ou/ qeou]/

[NA27 omits "son of god"]

...

01*, Q, 28, pc9, L2211, (Sy-Pal), sams, arm9mss, geo1,

[major manuscripts omitting, 01* = original Sinaiticus = the best witness]

Irpt, Or, Tit, Bas, Cyr, Epiph, Jerome,

[Church Fathers supporting omission. "Or" = Origen, a relatively honest Church Father by Church Father standards]

WH, NA25, Gre, Bois, Tis, Bal

[Authority supporting omission]

pc = 2862%, 530, 582*, 820*, 1021, 1436, 1555*89%, 1692, 2430, 2533

[minor manuscripts omission]

ui`ou/ tou/ qeou/ A, D, f1, f13, 33, 565, 579, 700, 892, 1071, 1342, 1424,
Maj, Sy-P, Sy-H
ui`ou/ qeou/ 01C1, B, D, L, W, 732, 1602, Latt, Sy, Co, goth,
WHmg, Weiss
tou/ qeou/ 055, pc4
ui`ou/ tou/ kuri,ou 1241

[Manuscript variation supporting inclusion]

...

9 quite uninteresting Byzantine minuscules support the omission.
[This is typical of the problem with simply asserting that "the Byzantine" supports an Orthodox reading. Even though this is what's said, what is meant is that it is just a majority]

...

On the other hand scribes often expand book titles.
JW:
Summary of why "son of god" is not original to Mark 1:1:

1) Quality and range of manuscripts supporting omission, especially Sinaiticus, which was changed to add, providing extant evidence of Forgery for the offending phrase.

2) Early Church Father quotes supporting omission, especially Origen, the outstanding early Church Father textual critic. 1) and 2) are decisive by themselves in supporting omission.

3) Addition explained by The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture. In the already Legendary book of the same name Ehrman explains on 72-75 the incentive of Orthodox scribes to add "son of god" at the start to counter the otherwise Adoptionist nature of "Mark" (actually, "Separationist" is probably a better term).

4) Significant variation of a simple phrase where it is added. A sure sign of Forgery. Scribes are not simply copying so they have to decide what exactly to add.

5) Internal evidence. "Mark" is written with a tight, sophisticated and consistent Literary structure and style. "Son of god" is Divine Revealed information at Baptism and Transfiguration and climatic human confession (by the Roman and not Peter) at the Crucifixion (and not resurrection). It doesn't fit the style for the Narrator to simply assert it at the beginning before the events unfold.

6) Christian Critical Authority generally supports omission.

7) Difficult reading principle. In women's tennis, always bet against the heterosexual and in Christian Bible variation always bet against the Orthodox reading. See The Word According To Garp, Mork, Mark. An Inventory of Significant Editing in the First Gospel

8) Tendency for Scribes to expand what could be considered a title such as the first sentence of a manuscript.



Joseph

INTERPRETER, n.
One who enables two persons of different languages to understand each other by repeating to each what it would have been to the interpreter's advantage for the other to have said.

http://www.errancywiki.com/index.php/Main_Page
JoeWallack is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 10:04 PM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.