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Old 01-19-2005, 04:33 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clivedurdle
Could references to swine actually be code for Romans?
Maybe in some instances but the parable of the Prodigal Son has him feeding swine at the bottom of his depravity. His deplorable condition is so bad that he envied the swine the husks that they ate.

Sometimes a pig is just a pig.

-Atheos
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Old 01-19-2005, 05:08 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Lucretius
...in the Bible
First of all sorry if this is the wrong place
Something that has intrigued me for a while is the reference to swine and swineherds in the Bible.
I have always wondered why the Jews would have had swine and swineherds as obviously they could not eat them what would be the purpose of actually keeping domesticated Pigs ? The fact that they have swineherds would imply they are domesticated and not just wild
Other than as a food source what possible use could they be ?
This is also explained in 'Jesus was Caesar', see 'The Gerasene Demoniac' in 'Words and Wonders' http://www.carotta.de/subseite/texte....html#gerasene

[...]
Even the ‘swine’—in the Gospels, ‘there was there nigh unto the mountains a great herd of swine feeding’ (Mk. 5:11)—are also found in Caesar’s story with insignificant phonetic variations: ‘farm livestock that came from Epirus in abundance…’[336]. Here too, two easily mistaken words: porcus and pecus, swine and farm livestock (which include swine). This surely was an understandable mistake because Caesar’s soldiers were suffering from such famine that they ate any animal, and eventually they began to dig for roots like unclean animals; from a root called chara they made, besides soup, also bread and ran towards the Pompeians throwing it triumphantly and full of contempt.[337] When Pompeius saw this bread he cried out: ‘What kind of beasts must we fight?’[338] Thêria—actually means small animals, in the sense of wild unclean animals, beasts. What he meant was, because of the fodder, ‘What pigs.’ Mk. 5:13: ‘And the unclean spirits went out, and entered into the swine’. Into the swine: choirus. What appears phonetically and optically as a mix of chara and thêria.

As with Gaul/Galilee, as well as Corfinium/Capharnaum, similar names and requisites appear within similar structures and sequences. So, we want to see if the parallel sequencing continues.
[...]
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Old 01-21-2005, 02:20 PM   #13
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How political are the Gospels? Could the story of the Prodigal Son also be an allusion to the Romans?

Has anyone looked at all the references to Rome and possible allusions - render unto Caesar for example - and what conclusions can be made?
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Old 01-23-2005, 10:15 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Clivedurdle
How political are the Gospels? Could the story of the Prodigal Son also be an allusion to the Romans?

Has anyone looked at all the references to Rome and possible allusions - render unto Caesar for example - and what conclusions can be made?
Again, read 'Jesus was Caesar' it is a major breakthrough (actually the solution, I think) in the Search for the historical Jesus.

The prodigal son is Brutus. From 'JWC', chapter 'Synoptic Comparison' p. 321:

"But in the middle of their Gospels Matthew and Luke add facts regarding
Caesar that either do not appear in Mark or appear in a different
manner or in an abbreviated form. So here, for example, one can detect
Brutus who had switched sides to Porcius (Cato), as the prodigal
son who joined himself to the swineherds; or one can recognize the vain
oath of the Pompeians before Pharsalos as the ban on swearing. And we
would detect with surprise, that behind Jesus’ famous words there are
Caesar’s laws and ordinances: so behind the Good Shepherd who
knows his sheep is Caesar’s measure to restrict the extension of pasture
at the expense of the arable farmland by limiting the use of slaves as
shepherds; [...] "
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Old 01-23-2005, 11:28 AM   #15
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Just seen a new book by Umberto Eco - too technical for me, but it points out major problems with translation, the concept of literal seems meaningless!

Quote:
Translation is always a shift,not between two languages but between two cultures. A translator must take into account rules that are not strictly linguistic but, broadly speaking, cultural.' Umberto Eco is of the world's most brilliant and entertaining writers on literature and language. In this accessible and dazzling study, he turns his eye on the subject of translations and the problems the differences between cultures can cause. The book is full of little gems about mistranslations and misunderstandings.For example when you put 'Studies in the logic of Charles Sanders Peirce' through an internet translation machine, it becomes 'Studies in the logic of the Charles of sandpaper grinding machines Peirce'. In Italian 'ratto' has no connotation of 'contemptible person' but denotes speed ('you dirty rat' could take on a whole new meaning!) What could be a weighty subject is never dull, fired by Eco's immense wit and erudition, providing an entertaining read that illuminates the process of negotation that all translators must make.
Mouse or Rat - Translation as Negotiation
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