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Old 02-19-2008, 02:59 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by reniaa View Post
This is the problem because we know bible figures so well, people expect archaeology just to pop up with graves and suchlike, but as we know only famous/Rich people by whichever of the days measurement got inscribed onto stone work and suchlike, pontious pilate and herod are both leaders the bible mentions both rich/famous and so we do have archaeological evidence of them. These ones we know from bible so well were just sheep hearders, carpenters, prophets, nothing that would make the people of the day make any mention of them on the walls of tombs etc.
This is quite true with respect to the characters in the New Testament. The problem becomes when we look for those Old Testament 'kings' like David and Solomon. We would expect to find similar archealogical evidence to what we have for Herod, however, that evidence simply is not there.
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Old 02-19-2008, 04:39 PM   #22
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I don't want a tomb....or even an inscription. I'd be happy to settle for any trace of the glorious city from which these two goat herders were supposed to have run their "empire."

Even a nice garbage midden full of 10th century debris would be an indication but....guess what? We don't have that, either.
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Old 02-19-2008, 05:22 PM   #23
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I don't want a tomb....or even an inscription. I'd be happy to settle for any trace of the glorious city from which these two goat herders were supposed to have run their "empire."

Even a nice garbage midden full of 10th century debris would be an indication but....guess what? We don't have that, either.
The evidence that history uses to verify kings of other nations are a lot less than you expect from Bible characters. Most of the Egyptian kings that are accepted on the same basis as those in the bible are rejected. They come from only one source. It was mentioned earlier about the scant information about David. The fact that a Syrian king mentioned a dynasty of King David doesn't seem to satisfy some people. It doesn't prove a glorius city, but it does prove there was a man named Davd that was once King of Israel,and makes Israel more than nomadic shepards. What do you want as evidence? How about the stables in Megiddo dated to the time of Solomon?
Fortunately for critics there may never be very much evidence to prove the early kngdom. The Christians, Jews and Muslims refuse to allow any digging around the Temple. Many of the Kings of Israel after the divided kingdom have been mentioned in Assyrian inscriptions. The Assyrians were not invading Canaan during the reigns of David and Solomon, and the other nations around Israel were not record keepers,especially the Philistines.
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Old 02-19-2008, 08:04 PM   #24
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Minimalist
I don't want a tomb....or even an inscription. I'd be happy to settle for any trace of the glorious city from which these two goat herders were supposed to have run their "empire."

Even a nice garbage midden full of 10th century debris would be an indication but....guess what? We don't have that, either.
It was mentioned earlier about the scant information about David. The fact that a Syrian king mentioned a dynasty of King David doesn't seem to satisfy some people. It doesn't prove a glorius city, but it does prove there was a man named Davd that was once King of Israel,and makes Israel more than nomadic shepards. .
Well that is being a little too easily satisfied with respect to David and Tel Dan.
There are several problems that intervene between the scanty info and the positive assertions you derive from such.
For starters the word 'king' is not on the inscription, there is only one letter which may refer to 'king' but also may not.
Also the person referred to in the inscription, if it is a person, is not directly linked to Jerusalem or Judah which would be expected of a reference to David.
The first part of the description, byt, could refer to a 'house' and thus reflect a patronate of the town or it could be 'temple', as the joining with the name suggests.
The second part of the description dwd could refer to "David" [I]but[/I
could also be a divine title, "The Beloved", as it appears to function in the Mesha Stele.
Finally, to presume that the inscription refers to a 'dynasty' or 'house', as in the royal house of Stuart in the English sense, is not warranted, It is, in other examples in the bible, used of persons who who were not heads of 'houses' ie royalty but instead leaders in a patronate sense.
That's a fair gap in [hopeful] interpretation.
I got the above information mainly from T.Thompson "The Mythic Past".
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Old 02-19-2008, 10:37 PM   #25
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Today, there are more than four churches which claim to possess the skull of St. John the Baptist, including Amiens, Nemours, and St-Jean d'Angeli in France and S. Silvestro in Capite in Rome. The arguments over authenticity became so ludicrous, that at one point two churchs agreed that while one had the head of St. John the Baptist preserved after his beheading, the other, which possessed a much smaller skull, must have the head of John as a child."
Where is CSI:Jerusalem when we need it?
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Old 02-19-2008, 10:41 PM   #26
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The head of John as a child?!

I wish these people would fail at breathing as badly as they fail at reality.
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