Civil1z@tion

The links between early Jewish and early Greek religion are going to be very tenuous at best for this reason: the Greeks were an Indo-European people with beliefs derived from Proto-Indo-European beliefs (such as the idea of the "sky father" originally known as "dyeus"), while Hebrew beliefs oriniginated in Proto-Semitic beliefs. Jewish religion is more closely related to ancient Sumerian and Egpytian beliefs than Greek.

Proto-Indo-European religion: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-I...opean_religion

Proto-Semitic religion: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Semitic_religion

Malachi151

Actually the Jewish god wasn't perfect either. Ironically, the idea of the "perfection" of God was introduced from the Greeks, though from later Greek philosophy. The same Greeks who conceived of a perfect "prime mover" also rejected the traditional Greek pantheon of gods as well.

Cesc

You're right, this whole subject is immense in itself. But Im not suggesting at all that one descended from the other.

I theorise that the prototype for the monotheistic "God" spoken of in the Bible is in large part Anu.

Or that the overall motif in the story of Jacob-Israel and El is properly a Biblical equivalent to the motif found in the greek story about Cronus and Uranus.

Ok, but Im not saying there are any links between early Jewish and Greek religion. But isnt the Proto-Semitic dieties and pantheons overwhelmingly developed from Mesopotamian lore through the millinia? And havnt also some basic stories in greek mythology originally come from Mesopotamia, ultimately developing dieties such as Anu and Ki (which also means 'sky' and 'earth') into Ur'anu's and Gaia? And Ishtar into Aphrodite etc.

The story of Uranus, Cronos and Zeus has most likely come through Anatolia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kumarbi
Where the 14th-13th century BC Hurrian Kumarbi (Cronos/Enlil) castrates his father Anu (Uranus) and his son is the stormgod Teshub (Zeus/Marduk) with his thunderbolts who conspires to overthrow them.
Shouldnt we consider "the Descent of Ishtar" to be the likely candidate for a prototype for the allegorical Mystery stories of the search for the lost one in the underworld by Isis, Persephone and Aphrodite?
As for similarities between Semitic mythology and Greek mythology, or "equivalent" motifs and dieties, arent there numerous both in and outside the Bible? I would say so.

Malachi151

Cesc, you may want to read my posts here:

http://iidb.infidels.org/vbb/showthr...47#post5218147

http://iidb.infidels.org/vbb/showthr...74#post5093674

Peter Kirby

The reasoning of the original post escapes me.

Specifically, the God of the Torah split up into several different gods, each being given a SINGLE representative Torah incident to match a single characteristic of the parent myth. Even if it were valid to divide the Torah/Pentateuch into piecemeal parts, and even if it were valid to discern different gods beyond different parts of it, how could a connection ever be established by a single point of similarity?

Generally, I've never really understood the school of study where myth parallels myth and therefore parent fathered child...and therefore we understand something better? If so, what did we get a handle on? I'd really like to understand it sometime in my lifetime, but I'm not there yet.

Toto

The human brain is wired to seek out patterns. It is generally satisfying to find a pattern, and even more satisfying if the timing of the similar items indicates a possible explanation.

Michael Shermer has made a career of using this principle to examine religious and other beliefs.

Cesc

Very very interesting, thx a lot.
There's also the great element of fertility symbolism in the Eden story: the serpent, tree, woman and garden, symbols of creation, sexual desire, reproduction, phallus, seed, womb etc. This is no doubt a reflection of basic near-east fertility symbolism probably not far removed geographically from the worship of Asherah pillars or "groves" and her serpent and great mother aspect etc.
I read that Hebrew pronunciation of 'Eve' (chawwah) sounds similar to Aramaic 'serpent' (hawweh). And that Hebrew 'serpent', 'n-g-sh', sounds like 'n-c-sh', 'sexual intercourse'. Perhaps a typical Hebrew wordpun, but is there anyone who can verify this?



Peter Kirby, my reasoning in the original post was only to sketch out an overall perspective of the idea, not to make the connection through the single points of similarities posted above.
Im not saying any of the three 'fathered' the other. However I do think comparative mythology is vital for Bible history.