Huon

You have an interesting page here, about the Black Virgin :

http://www.ancientquest.com/embark/blackvirgin.html

There is another Black Virgin in Czestochowa, Poland.

Huon

Nicholas, Bishop of Myra in Lycia, Also called Nicholas of Bari (South Italy). He died 6 December, 345 or 352. Though he is one of the most popular saints in the orthodox and the catholic Churches, there is scarcely anything historically certain about him except that he was Bishop of Myra. In 1087 Italian merchants stole his body at Myra, and brought it to Bari.

Saint Nicholas is celebrated in Germany, Lorraine, Switzerland and the Netherlands. He is supposed to bring gifts to the children, under the name of Santa Claus. Claus = Nicholas. A well known legend says that Nicholas resurrected three little children. These three children had been sent by their parents in the fields, where they were supposed to glean grain. But they got lost, and when the night came, they stopped at the house of a butcher. The butcher killed them and put them in a salting case. Some time later, saint Nicholas happened to stop near this house, found the three little corpses, and resurrected them.

Usually, Santa Claus goes with the Bogeyman.

Huon

Not everywhere. In France, there are presents, either at Christmas, or on January 1st.

Chili

For sure and you'll find a MacDonalds aound the corner.

Thomas II

...There was a disquieting moment...

Everyone immediately felt that Chili had tried to hit Huon below the belt with his remark about McDonalds...
It had been,as they say, unnecessary roughness...
Huon mind was racing...
Did he know about Sainte Catherine Centre?
Why had Chili said "around the corner"?
Was he at St Remi?
05 56 48 23 21...

Chili

Not at all. It was a comment made to say that things are probably changing in France as well. More to the point is that St Nicholas was never celebrated on Dec. 6. in most of France as Huon suggested in his previous post.

I wonder if they call call it Santa Claus of just Christmas with presents?

My point here is that St. Nicholas matches Epiphany but not Christmas (unless you want to call it Xmas withouth the -mas ending). To have presents at Christmas is an absolute contradiction with what Christmas stands for.

Huon

In Southern France, and also in Paris, children get presents from the Père Noël, Père = Father, Noël = latin Natalis = December 25. Santa Claus is an English name which is known in France, but not used.

The Catholic celebration of Saint Nicholas (of Myra) is on December 6. Of course, if children get their presents on Dec. 6, they will not get much on Dec. 25.

There are some other Saint Nicholas (of Somewhere), but their catholic celebration is not on January 6, Epiphany.

Huon

You can send a message to the bishops of France, so that they remind the French children of this idea.

jackrabbit

This thread hasn't mentioned baby jeebus for quite some time now.

Siamang

Is this some kind of Da Vinci Code reference?