steve_bnk

He was thorn in the side of the wealthy Jewish power elite.

From 'give to Caesar what is Caesar's' he would not have been anti-Roman. Jerusalam and the temple was big business of the day for the Jews with money to be made, they didn;t want to hear abiout fasting in the desert or siritual quuests that did not include welath. Not unlike the rich Christian TV evangelists of today. His proclaiming himself son of god was blashemy punishable by death I believe.

If a weatherbeaten Christian wanders out of the desert into a Sunday TV service at a mega-church proclaimg 'Give up your wealth and CD reveune and fast in the desert mediating on god, sinners repent the end is near, focus only on spiritual things and eternal salvation forget about cars and stereos', he'd end up in jail.

JABcomix

That's exactly the reason why. He caused trouble within the Jewish Religious Establishment. Jesus was no threat to the Roman Authority, nor did they see him that way. Jesus challenged the very foundations of the Jewish Religious life. He looked to free men from the enslavement of laws and rituals imposed onto them. He told men that they can have direct communion with God. He became a threat to the Sanhedrin. They tried and convicted him in the middle of the night. Not even his friends in the Sanhedrin were there to defend him. Pilate found no fault in Jesus. He was of the mind in letting him go. He knew he was innocent of all the charges brought against Jesus.

If Jesus had lived today, he would still have been killed by any Religious Authority trying to ensure their power over men. It is not that Jesus was sent here to be killed. If we were a more civilized society, we would have celebrated him while he was alive and allowed him to die at a ripe old age. However, given our propensities to fly off the handle whenever any new idea threatens our way of life, Jesus would have been killed now just as they killed him then.

PhilosopherJay

Hi Mountainman,

Good point.

Warmly,

Philosopher Jay

show_no_mercy

If Jesus was a threat to the Jewish establishment, why didn't they kill him themselves? Why whisk Jesus away to Pilate in the middle of the night? Why didn't the Jews present Jesus as a threat to Herod?

According to Josephus, Herod killed John the Baptist because John was too popular and Ηerod thought he was going to start a rebellion. Wait a minute, isn't that supposed to be why Jesus was executed? Because he was too popular? Why wasn't there a kangaroo court for John the Baptist in the middle of the night? Why wasn't John the Baptist presented to Pilate and crucified?

And why is Pilate presented as being reluctant to execute Jesus? The historical Pilate was hot tempered and executed troublemakers without trial. In the gospel narrative, he gives a trial to both Jesus and Barabbas, finding no fault in the former.

Jesus could have only been an insurrectionist since he was crucified, thus the Jews would have had no hand in his execution.

Tristan Scott

I think it was a case of mistaken identity and confusion.
Pilate gave them the choice of crucifying (1) Jesus the King of the Jews, or (2) Jesus the son of God and they chose (1).

NZSkep

Interesting thread.

I was about to post a thread with a similar question

Not: why was Jesus Killed

But: Why did God require Jesus to be killed?

I’ve never been very cofmortable with the logic behind “Jesus died for our sins” statement.
I wonder “why did jesus have to die for our sins at all?” couldn’t god have just forgiven us anyway, being the all powerful guy he is?

Toto

Christians come up with very strange justifications for the sacrifice, as if God's infinite need for justice requires a sacrifice to atone for sin, ignoring God's infinite power, wisdom, or beneficence.

john_v_h

That's because there isn't any logic behind it. All the "logic" came afterward, as you can read in the writings of Paul and his theological successors.

As someone else pointed out, the real reason for Jesus' death is dramatic pathos. And fulfillment of primitive preoccupations with sacrifice.

show_no_mercy

Christianity being a reaction to the destruction of the 2nd temple in 70 CE is the perfect explanation for this. Since no more sin offerings could be made at the now non-existent temple, there had to have been some sort of super, ultimate sacrifice made so that mankind could still be saved. Thus "Jesus" is retroactively made the Paschal Lamb sacrifice one generation prior to the temple's destruction.

JABcomix

If they could, they would have. However, being under Roman Occupation meant that they could not put a man to death themselves. That would be against Roman law. (Which is strange because they could evidently put a woman to death by stoning. I guess men were worth more than women back then)

They didn't bring Jesus to Herod at first for the same reasons I mentioned above.

However, when Jesus was brought to Herod after seeing Pilate first, Herod also found no fault in him to warrant execution.

There were many reasons why Jesus was captured in the middle of the night.

1) Jesus' followers would be unaware of this. The crowds wouldn't gather to save Jesus. Jesus also plainly told his Apostles not to interfere. And when Jesus was eventually presented before the crowds, he was so badly beaten that many didn't even recognize him.

2) The Sanhedrin members symphatetic to Jesus would not be up at 2 AM. Only certain Sanhedrin members were summoned to the Judgement of Jesus. Therefor, the trial was one-sided.

3) They wanted to get all this Murder of Jesus business out of the way before the Sabbath was to begin. The Sabbath begins at sundown on Friday. It is prohibited under Jewish law to do any sort of work on the Sabbath, that includes murdering innocent men.

Lastly, they didn't bring Jesus to Pilate right away, they had a trial at the Sanhedrin and found Jesus guilty of the charges they trumped up. The Jewish guards beat him up a bit then he was brought to Pilate around 6 AM.

Also, getting back to Herod. He knew of Jesus all along and never really found him a threat, so he would let Jesus do his ministry work without interfering. All this animosity towards Jesus originated in the Sanhedrin.