spin

If you want to comment on Bruno you should be able to read what he says. I'm not paid to translate it for you. If you want to crap on about Bruno, you need to lift your game.

Get your Bruno source to provide the statement he made to the Venetian authority for you.

Well, obviously you're not much interested: you haven't dealt with very much of Bruno at all. Compare him with what other people of his time were saying. Your modern judgment about his views is as meaningful as the Bruno quote I cited from his Venetian colloquy is to you.


spin

Lafcadio

Yeah, compare him with Cusanus or Copernic and we realize that he said little else. Compare him with Roger Bacon (centuries before him) and his followers and we realize that he had no clue what natural philosophy was about, less to advocate it. As for calling simple assertions "scientific views" or "scientific positions" only shows the huge misunderstanding people have regarding science. As long they have computers, TV and hamburgers what would they care anyway?

spin

:rolling:

Still doing this:


:wave:

Buridan

:down: :huh: :Cheeky:

Ad infinitum.

Lafcadio

Bede

I fear this thread is coming to the end of its natural life. Still, it was fun.

I will try and put together a fully referenced article on the various myths that we have seen debunked (although not always here). From memory these would be:

• Flat earth
• Lightning rods
• Vesalius and the inquisition
• Church banning zero
• Church banning human dissection
• Church burning scientists

If I've missed any out then do please let me know.

Best wishes

Bede

spin

Macche' bellezza. Ha imparato almeno qualcosa nella sua partecipazione!

Lafcadio

Spre deosebire de tine care n-ai invatat nimic

spin

While Italian is relevant to understanding Bruno, Romanian is not relevant in this thread at all.

spin

While the hypocrites pour scorn on Bruno and refuse to see him in his context, they turn a blind eye to the patent rubbish that Kepler was responsible for publishing. Bruno is attacked for retaining the ideas of those who came before him, but people are silent about Kepler. As Bruno adhered to the four elements so did Kepler, but Bruno is repudiated. Kepler held to the notion of platonic solids representing the structure of the solar system (and thus his limited universe), though Bruno didn't, but Bruno was repudiated. Bruno talks about the inherent forces which drove the planets, while Kepler was an adherent of the effects of the stars and the planets (ie astrology), and only Bruno is repudiated. Kepler stumbled onto his laws of planetary motion which trying to prove Pythagorian harmony of the spheres. Had Bruno done that, he would have been repudiated for it.

What we see in this thread regarding Bruno is a concerted effort to tar Bruno by not treating his efforts fairly in their context. Kepler fortunately lived under fairly stable conditions (even though his mother had been tortured as a witch -- he defended her and gained her release) and didn't have the instability guaranteed to Bruno. Nevertheless, Bruno traveled Europe, taught at universities, argued with leading scholars, published his ideas about the universe, which were based on Copernicus and the platonists, but which also contained his own ideas. What people don't seem to like is that Bruno was not a scientist, but a theorist on science. And that his theories were quite reasonable and even shown to be correct, but he wasn't the scientist who did the observation and of course in those times such observation or tools for it weren't available to anyone. People want the impossible for Bruno while ignoring the idiocies from others who they esteem.

Bruno was bound and gagged and placed on a pire in the middle of Piazza Campo de' Fiori and burnt alive with his ashes left to blow away in the wind, while revellers celibrated the jubilee year. This was the defeat of science. The lone voice of reason cannot survive against the multitude of unreason. We had to wait long before such voices stopped being lone. We had to have Galileo recant on ideas he generally knew to be correct (and yes he made mistakes). The church was fighting to maintain control by nullifying any free thought. Yes, Bede, science was burnt in an effort to stifle it. Burnt or bullied.


spin