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Old 06-16-2001, 07:24 PM   #71
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by rodahi:
I get it. If the Genesis account of creation was a painting, it would be a Salvadore Dali, or maybe a Jackson Pollack.

rodahi

</font>
Take it easy rodahi, our friend jaliet has a good point and if the answer was simple he would not have isseud the challenge to Christians.

Sorry if my answer seems blurred to you but it is really simple and obvious to me.

Amos
 
Old 06-17-2001, 07:31 AM   #72
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Amos123:
Genesis 1 is an account of creation, adaptation and salvation and explains evolution.
</font>
Which part explains how man evolved from apes? Which animals evolved from what?
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Genesis 2 is also an account of creation, adaptation and salvation but here that which was created in Gen. 1 takes form and begins to evolve.</font>
Just be serious, please. Gen 1:2 talks about the spirit of God hovering over the face of the waters. Genesis 2:1 talks about God resting on the 7th day and forming man. Which one are you referring to?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Gen.3 is also an account of creation and here the tabula rasa is created to make involution possible as the first step of evolution.
</font>
And what is involution? is there a difference between "the first step of evolution" and "life begins to evolve"? does the latter take place after the first step or they occur together?
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
1)The "deep" is the vacuum needed for the creation of life.
</font>
So you are saying that science is wrong and that Energy and matter can be created from nothing? Ok, I can take that. Where was this vaccum - what created it? what surrounded it? How come it did not such "the spirit" into itself?
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
2) The "light" created in Gen.3 is life.
</font>
The life of what? Where was it kept?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
3)The "day" is knowledge and the "night" begs the question for knowledge in effort to enlighten the omniscient mind of the intelligent designer.
</font>
So, what is Knowledge one, Knowledge two, Knowledge three....Knowledge seven? What are they? Astronomy, Biology...?
Please explain
Night 1, Night 2...Night 7 explain those too. Please
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
4) The "firmament" is the mind of God and the mind of Lord God
</font>
What is the difference between God and Lord God? What were they before the firmanent was created?
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
..the firmanent is the division of the waters from the waters to make evolution possible between the generations without losing continuity between the generations.
</font>
What is continuity?
How can continuity be lost? Why is "continuity" so important?
Which waters are these that are being separated?
 
Old 06-17-2001, 07:35 AM   #73
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Amos123:
Take it easy rodahi, our friend jaliet has a good point and if the answer was simple he would not have isseud the challenge to Christians.

Sorry if my answer seems blurred to you but it is really simple and obvious to me.

Amos
</font>
I read this.

 
Old 06-17-2001, 10:13 AM   #74
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Amos123:
Hello jaliet

Genesis 1 is an account of creation, adaptation and salvation and explains evolution.

Genesis 2 is also an account of creation, adaptation and salvation but here that which was created in Gen. 1 takes form and begins to evolve.

Gen.3 is also an account of creation and here the tabula rasa is created to make involution possible as the first step of evolution.

1)The "deep" is the vacuum needed for the creation of life.

2) The "light" created in Gen.3 is life.

3)The "day" is knowledge and the "night" begs the question for knowledge in effort to enlighten the omniscient mind of the intelligent designer.

4) The "firmament" is the mind of God and the mind of Lord God is the division of the waters from the waters to make evolution possible between the generations without losing continuity between the generations.

</font>

These are merely your own unsupported personal interpretations and nothing more. They are also pretty wild interpretations. Like other Christians, you interpret the text in such bizarre ways that you can get the text to say whatever you want it to. There is nothing in the Bible to support these interpretations of yours.

Truethinker, another Christian on this board, said that the firmament meant "air." So now we have two Christians taking the same text and telling us that it means two different things. So who has the right interpretation? If the Bible really was the Word of God, why is it interpreted so differently even among Christians? God obviously did a horrible job of writing his Word, because even people of his religion can't figure out what the Bible says.

Your interpretation is just wild personal speculation with no evidence to support it. You are simply taking the words and trying to fit them to what you know about evolution, but the lengths you have to go to do this make your assertions look ridiculous. If God really meant what you say, then why didn't God speak more plainly?

[This message has been edited by JamesKrieger (edited June 17, 2001).]
 
Old 06-17-2001, 10:51 AM   #75
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by jaliet:
Quote:
Originally posted by Amos123:
Genesis 1 is an account of creation, adaptation and salvation and explains evolution.
</font>
Which part explains how man evolved from apes? Which animals evolved from what?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Genesis 2 is also an account of creation, adaptation and salvation but here that which was created in Gen. 1 takes form and begins to evolve.</font>
Just be serious, please. Gen 1:2 talks about the spirit of God hovering over the face of the waters. Genesis 2:1 talks about God resting on the 7th day and forming man. Which one are you referring to?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
Gen.3 is also an account of creation and here the tabula rasa is created to make involution possible as the first step of evolution.
</font>
And what is involution? is there a difference between "the first step of evolution" and "life begins to evolve"? does the latter take place after the first step or they occur together?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
1)The "deep" is the vacuum needed for the creation of life.
</font>
So you are saying that science is wrong and that Energy and matter can be created from nothing? Ok, I can take that. Where was this vaccum - what created it? what surrounded it? How come it did not such "the spirit" into itself?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
2) The "light" created in Gen.3 is life.
</font>
The life of what? Where was it kept?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
3)The "day" is knowledge and the "night" begs the question for knowledge in effort to enlighten the omniscient mind of the intelligent designer.
</font>
So, what is Knowledge one, Knowledge two, Knowledge three....Knowledge seven? What are they? Astronomy, Biology...?
Please explain
Night 1, Night 2...Night 7 explain those too. Please
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
4) The "firmament" is the mind of God and the mind of Lord God
</font>
What is the difference between God and Lord God? What were they before the firmanent was created?
Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">
..the firmanent is the division of the waters from the waters to make evolution possible between the generations without losing continuity between the generations.
</font>
What is continuity?
How can continuity be lost? Why is "continuity" so important?
Which waters are these that are being separated?
Sorry jaliet, I thought you were on to something but I guess you are not.


 
Old 06-17-2001, 03:49 PM   #76
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Smile

I'll toss in another interpretation, the firmament or 'hammered out bowl' is the asteroid belt which separates the planets with water, Earth and at one time Mars & Venus, from the planets with frozen waters , Jupiter & Saturn Neptune & Uranus.
 
Old 06-18-2001, 02:21 AM   #77
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by marduck:
I'll toss in another interpretation, the firmament or 'hammered out bowl' is the asteroid belt which separates the planets with water, Earth and at one time Mars & Venus, from the planets with frozen waters , Jupiter & Saturn Neptune & Uranus.</font>
Ok, lets put christian interpretations aside. The christians are either busy or dont know or are saying absurd things.
Marduck
I understand that like the Epic of Gilgamesh, the Astra Hasis and Enuma Elish are "dumbed down" versions of what could have been the real story - which only the initiates (then) knew. The real story can only be speculated upon. Alan Alford has a Good theory about it in his book "When the Gods Came Down". His is about exploded planet cults - that a planet exploded which then fecundated the fertile earth with life - thus the annunaki etc. But I dont see his theory standing up without the Gaea Hypothesis - which states that the Earth is a living thing.
The Bible, is a conglomeration of Occulted myths from these ancient legends from the middle East, and all over the World.
Ultimately, one will be left wondering what really happened and how the 'initiates' got to know what happened.

But I am digressing, back to your interpretation: Why would it have been important to separate the planets with frozen waters from those planets with waters before getting down to the task at hand? Feel free to speculate. I wont hold you down for proofs and explanations.


 
Old 06-18-2001, 04:54 PM   #78
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": Why would it have been important to separate the planets with frozen waters from those planets with waters before getting down to the task at hand? Feel free to speculate. I wont hold you down for proofs and explanations."

This interpretation came from "Genesis Reviisted" by Zechariah Sitchin. his reading of the Enuma Elish is that of a tale of how our solar system was affected by a rouge planet called Nibiru with an eliptical orbit comming past the sun every 3600 years. He claims this planet, also called Marduk, is to blame for the fact Uranus is tipped over, Neptune losing a moon to Marduk, and how a planet called Tiamat was once where the asteroid belt is now, Marduk hit Tiamat creating the asteroid belt and Earth and moving Earth to where it is now, our moon was once a moon of Tiamat. It is an interesting take on the Enuma Elish but I don't know how well it fits with celestial mechanics.
It is odd though how the Sumerians had names for distant planets like Neptune, Uranus & Pluto and that they referred to Earth as the 7th planet, Earth is only the 7th planet if you count from the outside in, we usually call it the third planet from the Sun out!
I've seen pictures of 6000 year old carvings with the Sun in the center surrounded by 11 planets (they include the moon and Nibiru/Marduk)
 
Old 06-18-2001, 11:45 PM   #79
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Thumbs up

Marduck,
I havent read any of Sitchins books but I have read about his deep insights into the myths/ legends in ancient mosopotamia.
What I'd like to know is: Is God Nibiru? and the Earth is Tiamat? - according to Sitchins interpretation?
Alford used this theory in his book The Gods of the New Millenium - but on further research, he changed his paradigm and said that these were not planets but rather asteroids. Astronomers like Erick Van Flandern have supported his theories - partly. Thus he published his new book When The Gods Came Down - with an altogether new theory. Exploded planets.
Does he give any interpretations about the Epic of Gilgamesh? because I undertand, that the correct interpretation should be that Gilgamesh, even Unamapitshim(?) - in Enuma Elish was not a flesh-and-blood man but a planet of some sort - even the Moses of Exodus...
But it gets a bit complicated for me. I have put study on hold for now.
There are so many questions. After reading, the questions only increase...

The Annunaki(the black headed ones) were fiery comets that fecundated the earth with life. I could write up a detailed interpretation later this week if you are interested in hearing. I wonder Marduck - what do you think about all this - what happened - who created the planets? there was a time I thought I had figured it out, but nowadays it seems to be drawing further away...


 
Old 06-19-2001, 03:39 AM   #80
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by marduck:
": Why would it have been important to separate the planets with frozen waters from those planets with waters before getting down to the task at hand? Feel free to speculate. I wont hold you down for proofs and explanations."

This interpretation came from "Genesis Reviisted" by Zechariah Sitchin. his reading of the Enuma Elish is that of a tale of how our solar system was affected by a rouge planet called Nibiru with an eliptical orbit comming past the sun every 3600 years. He claims this planet, also called Marduk, is to blame for the fact Uranus is tipped over, Neptune losing a moon to Marduk, and how a planet called Tiamat was once where the asteroid belt is now, Marduk hit Tiamat creating the asteroid belt and Earth and moving Earth to where it is now, our moon was once a moon of Tiamat. It is an interesting take on the Enuma Elish but I don't know how well it fits with celestial mechanics.
</font>
Sitchin is a total idiot of the Eric Von Daniken school. Nothing Sitchin says is actually possible, much of it is racist, and all of it is wrong.

Michael

 
 

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